i know where i stand on this issue but i was wondering what everyone
elses opinion was of losing parts of the freedoms that make this country
great to just feel safer?
the US government no longer hides illegal wiretaps and are trying to
make it common practice and in light of the recent news story about the
canadian citizen who was wrongly deported, imprisoned and tortured under
the watchful eye of the US government because he was seen meeting with
someone who was under surveilance. as the US moves more towards the
enemies tactics, do you think it helps the way we are perceived in the
world? do you think that any of the security measures implemented since
9/11 have actually made this country safer or do you just feel better
about your safety?
the truth is, we are not safer and never will be. the government and
security agencies can do whatever they want but it is never going to be
safer. the world is a big place, don't let them take the freedoms you do
have under the disguise of safety because in the end, it won't matter.
it isn't any more difficult to get guns, knives and bombs onto
airplanes and across borders than it was before 9/11. what happened to
all that solidarity and courage that people showed shortly after the
attacks? what happened to the spirit of the people who went down in the
field in pennsylvania because they were not going to sit idly by and
allow a terrorist to take their lives for their cause. are you willing
to have that kind of courage to stand up for yourself and your neighbor
or are you gonna give up your rights in exchange for the false security
of the government patting you on the back and saying," there, there
everything will be alright. just sign over all your rights and we'll
take care of you."
if people keep allowing these small violations of human rights and
privacy, the violations are only gonna keep getting bigger and they'll
keep giving you the same old excuse they have always given you and they
keep feeding you the bullshit because you keep eating it up. there is no
justification for a misdeed therefore there is no excuse.

KB,

As a Veteran of the United States Army myself...I have to say there are
no easy answers to any of this. In my never to be humble opinion
however - these tyrants in thrid world countries are getting more and
more brazen in how they infultrate our country and compromise our
freedoms...we have no choice but to resort to such tactics in order to
maintain the upper hand on these lunatics...I don't know about you -
but it scares the hell out of me to think Iraq could be building Nuclear
weapons and with likes of Saddam in power...who knows what they are
capable of doing with those weapons. Saddam could be very mild to the
new heads of government now forming in that region. I know it does not
seem right that we should "Police" other parts of the world, but as the
wealthiest, most educated nation in the world, we have a responsiblity
to keep watch over those Countries that would rise up and compromise our
freedoms and kill our men, women and children...let alone their own.

J

no
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm all for wire taps baby...

J

hate me if you must

not me. our gov. is a bunch of crooks!

maybe so in many ways...but do you hate your way of life and your
freedom so much that you would want it compromised by an insane facist?

REMEMBER 9/11???!!

We are really lucky motherfuckers in this country.
We get to fuck around, laugh, enjoy ourselves
and have a good time while our military is around
the world protecting us from evil bitches.
Tap into my phone.
Fuck it.
You might hear phone sex once in awhile (kiding here for
all the haters)
If that's the price you pay to be safe, then I'm all for it.
Also, most people don't realize that only a small percent of
calls, I think mainly calls made to and from terrorist countries
are monitored. The government could care less about listening
to our private shit on the phone.

That's right Jimi, they could give a shit about who's heavy breathin'
all they want is to monitor whomever might take your freedom away to do
that!!! or whomever might be planning just to blast the shit right out
of you instead!! I don't know about anyone else, but I want my
grandchildren to see their grandchildren..........


USA!!!

im going to leave it alone!!

fuck this topic!!!

How do we keep our freedom? I've read this topic on message boards every
from abovetopsecret.com to the 420 board at myspace. Everyone sees this
is as an issue, but no one ever has ananswer on how to stop it from
continuing.

i feel safe no matter what, i have my family, i dont want my privacy to
be public, my little brother is in the army, and i am proud of him, i am
tired of people trying to make stuff about us and only us, there are
other countries, and we are all the same, we all have fears, we all have
families, and most of us have jobs, so lets lets just be with our
families

way to go k. breeze.... ya know how to stir shit up!!!!!!

NO they are not making us safer. It is an illegal act from our
goverment as they say they no longer need warrents for many actions that
under the constution require it. The line probable cause is illegal.
They have no right to search me, my car, my home, my property, ect.
without a warrant. Listening in on our phone calls is also illegal. It
was deemed so by the supreme court long ago as we did not have phones
when the constitution was writen.

I am looking for a civil war to begin here again because the goverment
has quit listening to the people. I just hope we can make it a political
one, but to do this we have to vote for common people who have not been
in politics like Kingbreeze(lol).

Maybe some of us would feel differently about these issues if we had a
child or a family memeber who died for nothing in the trade center. I
know this is a touchy subject and every has an opinion...

But, in my book, if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear
and I'm willing to give up a small portion of privacy to keep these
crazy bastards out of my backyard!!

Anthrax anybody?

the world is a much different and dangerous place than it was 200 years
ago honeyrobber....


Have I made any jane haters yet!!??

we arent safe..we'll never be safe..i'm not giving up my freedom to the
government..the government stinks..they dont know what theyre doing.
911? other countries go through stuff like that all the time..the US
thinks theyre so much better than everyone else. ya know, come on, 5
years later and there's still crap all over the tv about 911..look at
all the lives that were lost fighting in this stinkin war..those men
faught for there country, i know, but are we any better off? have we
come one step further since 911?

I would give up a cetain degree of my privacy for the greter cause of
the good. Because when I look at my son. And I think that some crazy ass
fuck thinks he can stroll into my country and play hard ball straight
from the desert all in the name of "ALLAH" (or how ever the fuck you
spell it). My response to them is a BIG FUCK YOU IN YOUR FACE. Tap my
phone, but while your doing that someone better be knockin on my door to
hand me a fuckin m-16 and some MRE's because I am ready to roll NOW!
I served my country I know what it take's and if some people are not
willing to give "a little" for all the great ammenities that this
country offers. Then they are greedy and selfish and cowardly period. It
is not like the government is like oh hey let's let them build nuclear
weapons and nuke us. Where the hell do you think those politicians live
here duh? I do not envy the president's job at all I would not want it.
I do not particularly even think he is a good one. And I know that in
some countries if you were to say that about some fashist regime you'd
be stoned to death in the street's. So perfect case in point right there
we truly do live in the greatest country in the world. So many freedoms
and rights it is unreal to a point. So how you can set up and say that
you have it all togother and know better than the people voted into
office? If you do then give it a crack a run for it fix it yourself. But
do not set back and use 9/11 to fire people up and doubt our government.
I by no means have blind faith in them But!! I also understand that
policies (i.e. airport security etc.) have holes and flaws. And you have
dumb asses out there trying to sneak scissors onto airplanes just to see
if they can. Do you not think we the people are partly at fault when we
pull stupid shit like that???? I mean these crazy bastards are now
saying that the POPE should be put to death for quoting someone from
like the 14th century.. I say fuck it someone needs to lay down the law
and NO I do not feel they are giving me a false sense of security I feel
they are doing the best they can. And for the rights and freedoms we
have we should back them until given a reason not too. But thus far I am
behind them %100. And if you think they just keep feeding you lines of
shit to get you to think it's o.k. why don't you try signing up for the
service there king and take a tour or two through the middle east and
tell those men and women they are over there for nothing? Because the
government is just feeding us crap. Go ahead say that to a marine dare
ya'( I was one and I can tell u what would happen if you'd like ) Shame
on you if you doubt them people like you cause fear, confusion and
panic. Without order and and structure and someone to run it guess what
u have? Anarchy, chaos and failure. And that Sir is a country I would
not want to be in. So if you doubt it fine get the hell out and take
your chances in ohhh say Afghanistan. You might like it better there.
They don't tap your phones and feed you bullshit. They just kill you in
the fuckin street like a dog. SEMPER FI

P.S. YOU GO JANE, I GOT YOUR BACK ALL THE WAY GIRL TELL IT LIKE IT IS.
SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, NO. I AM NOT NOR WILL I EVER BE "A JANE
HATER". :)

KING ARE YOU NUTS...

The founding fathers said to us to NEVER EVER give up your freedoms for
liberty and freedom for Safety and Security...

Because if you give up liberty and freedom you won't get safety nor
security but what YOU WILL GET is complete and total
T.Y.R.A.N.N.Y....O.P.P.R.E.S.S.I.O.N

ya dig? it's just that simple and it's the facts my man...the founding
fathers and mothers of this country of America fought and died for just
simple average people for everyone to have freedom and liberty and a
constitution and bill of rights to ensure that our rights and liberties
are NOT infringed on by government...

For government to be THE SERVANT of THE PEOPLE NOT thee other way
around...

You see everyone and King....the founding fathers did NOT just make up
the consitution and bill of rights out of thought of what we should
have...

They gave us and made up our rights on paper as a guarantee for the
people to control our own destiny's in our own country..the founding
fathers we're not just men and women coming to build a new world...they
ESCAPED slavery and oppression from their past land of Britain and away
from tyrannical governments...they we're HISTORIANS and history teaches
us even today that if you let government take care of you...then just
like dictators like:

Stalin
Mao Tse Tung
Hitler
Pol Pot
Kim Jun Ill

...And other types of dictators take control of their
population...ENSLAVE their populations using their corrupt minions or
government to make slaves of their people and then that population
becomes very very bad as a whole and many tragic and horrible things
come out of it...

I mean I can go on and on with major factual points and believe me if I
do the facts that I know could be shocking even to share on here...

Benjamin Franklin said "Those who seek to give up liberty and freedom
for safety or security deserve NEITHER safety or security"

All this spying and wiretapping folks (for those who live here) is
ILLEGAL and against your 4th Amendment tot he Bill of Rights...but you
see these criminals in power KNOWWWWW you are not going to go and LEARN
about your history and rights that are UN-ALIENABLE RIGHTS NOT given to
us by government but by god to be FREE human beings and to NOT let
government become our masters but thee other way around...THE
PEOPLE...WEEEE THE PEOPLE are the lords and masters above government in
America...

The government, police, OFFICIALS (Gods or Lords) are in FACT are PUBLIC
(SERVANTS) of the people as we ELECT THEM to SERVE US...

Let me put it this simple way ladies and gentlemen and please don't
attack the messenger when I am just giving you the facts on these
questions I would like people to think about here...

1) Is Al-Qaida taking your freedoms away?

2) Did Osama Bin Laden ask bush (as we speak) to sign onto to dissolve
our borders and to merge America, Canada and Mexico into ONE MAJOR North
American Community (The Pan American Union) which will be the Death of
America, the constitution and bill of rights?? (check SPP.GOV)

3) Is Al-Qaida putting up Surveillance cameras everywhere (total big
brother) to watch EVERYTHING you do and FACE SCAN YOU down to your
walking motion...


Who benefits from so called "Terror"?? everytime a crisis arises there
will ALWAYS be a solution....and the key words you will hear are...

"SAFETY"...."SECURITY" "Give up your rights and liberties and let us
keep you safe (evil grins)"

I mean are you getting the point people?? I mean are you really starting
to think for a moment?? I mean I'm not trying to be impressive or
anything...

As for this overall question NOOOOO I will NEVER EVER give up my freedom
and liberty for safety and security....the german people fell for that
little trick when hitler burned his own reichstag to gain power over the
germany people and got RID of the germany constitution and gave all
power onto himself after the crisis he created and the people fell for
it....

HISTORY people...."Those who forget their history is DOOMED to repeat
it!" always keep that in mind...