I once knew a thinker name wux
he thought that the universe sucks
if it came from a god,
the design is quite odd
for it's not even close to deluxe


Could a universe as seemingly grotesques as this one, be the craftsmanship of an "intelligent" designer?

Many people have voiced a personal opinion that if there is an intelligent designer responsible for having created this universe that entity should be held in contempt of humanity!

But why?

Because this universe isn't perfect?

What would a perfect universe be like?

No death? That would certainly be nice, right?

But wait! If there's no death, then surely there also wouldn't be any birth! Why bother with that?

In a perfect universe why not just have a pre-designed perfect population of humans and be done with it?

But wait! That would mean no cute little babies. That would mean no toddlers, no children, no big brothers or sisters Gee, no moms and dads for that matter.

In fact everyone would be equally related! Brothers and sister with no moms and dads and no children. All the same age and in the same health. And everyone better be just as good-looking as everyone else otherwise someone would feel less than perfect.

No sex either! What's the point to it if we're not going to procreate? So no males and females. Just one gay unisexual brotherhood of celibate non-sexuals.

Are you bored yet?

The world is perfect. So no need to poop or have plumbing, toilets, or toilet paper.

In fact, no point in having to eat anything either. In a perfect world, we should never feel hungry or even tired.

No need to sleep either. In a perfect world we shouldn't need to rest.

No need to ever clean anything up, or take a bath. After all, in a perfect world we should never get dirty.

No B.O. No need to brush our teeth. In fact, since we won't be eating anything there's no need to even have any teeth. No need to talk in a perfect world either. Why not just telecommunicate via the mind and not even bother vibrating the air?

No need to touch each other. In a perfect world no one would be longing to be touched. After all, if they longed to be touch that would imply that something wasn't perfect.

Do you see problem with a perfect world yet?

Would it make sense to even bother with a perfect world?

Now you might say, "Well it doesn't need to be as horrific as this world!"

Oh come on. Give me a break people, is this world really that bad?

To make the world interesting there had to be some imperfections. Someone had to draw a line somewhere and say, "We'll let things get this far out of whack, and no further."

Humans have built-in systems to protect us from too much pain.

First off, most emotional pain is self-inflicted by the very psychology of the person who is becoming emotionally upset. So they are creating their own pain in those situations by how strongly they allow themselves to react to, or dwell on, a particular situation.

In the realm of physical pain, there are built-in safeguards. If we experience too much pain we go into a state of shock. If we get too mangled we die. Also, if life is truly spiritual, then death is a meaningless concept anyway. (let's not forget that we are justifying a designer here, so if there is a designer, then there's probably eternal life too. )

So death doesn't even count as a bad thing in this scenario.

Also, if we find life so distraught that we can't handle it we usually do die. Even doctors will tell you that people who have a will to live are more likely to recover than people who genuinely have no will to live.

So why should we assume that in order to have an intelligent designer of this universe, it should be any "better" than it already is? Clearly it can't be 'perfect'. No two people are even going to agree on what "perfect" should even mean anyway. The less perfect it is, the more challenging and exciting it is. Some of the best novels have been written on War and Peace. Would we truly cherish peace if we never knew of war? Or would we start taking peace for granted and just get bored to death with it?

I suggest that in a totally perfect world there would be nothing to do. Because if anything needed to be done it wouldn't be perfect. That's pretty straight-forward.

We couldn't even have a game of chess, because in a perfect world no one could lose! If someone lost the game the world would be imperfect for them.

The whole idea of a perfect world makes no sense.

So for a world to be interesting there needs to be challenges, risks, dangers, and boogiemen to jump out at you and scream BOO!

Otherwise you'd be bored to death. The more dangerous it is, the more dramatic it is. The more dramatic it is, the more intense it is. So whoever designed this universe made it dramatic enough to be intense. Thus giving us the chance to experience genuine passion, the thrill of victory, and the agony of defeat.

That's what gives life gusto! Without the dangers and challenges life would be blasé

So we can't just look at the dangers and challenges in life and say, "There can't be an intelligent designer because this life isn't intelligent!"

That's nonsense and just doesn't cut it. This world isn't all that cruel overall. Especially if there is a spiritual quality to it. If that's true then there is also an afterlife and many more lives to live! So death can't even be counted as a 'bad thing' in this scenario.

Sure, if there is no creator and this is a one-shot deal. And death is the end of the road. Then life is indeed quite cruel for some people and quite pleasant for others. But that's not what's being considered here. There's no need to justify an existence that's totally happenstance to begin with. There's nothing to justify.


So here's the question:

If there is a "creator", was the creator justified in creating life the way it is?

What say you?

How "perfect" should life be before it's so perfect that it's utterly boring and meaningless?

Very interesting question Abra.

I think the first thing I would suggest, if I were in a position to have input into the creation, would be to fix "language". I'd make it so that there was only one language and one meaning for every word and everything would have a single word that referred to it and only it. That way you could go anywhere in the universe and be able to communicate easily with anyone you every encountered.

Although, I even better than that would be some sort of "controllable telepathy" where communication did not require any physical medium at all, but could still be turned on and off at will - so you didn't have to hear everyone elses thoughts all the time and other's could only hear what thoughs of yours you wanted them to hear.

Secondly I would make it so that people could design and create any type of body they wanted and transfer their "self" (whatever one considers that to be) from body to body. Kinda like being able to design and create any kind of vehicle one wanted and switch between them whenever you wanted based on where you wanted to go and what you wanted to do.

Other than that, I can't think of any other "really big" changes I'd make.

Ahhhh, another page to add to my ever growing book of "Abracadabra Posts".

I think you hit the nail on the head with "communication". It seems to cause the most problems in any relationship whether it be personal, romantic, business or otherwise. If communication breakdowns could be avoided it would solve so many problems.

And, speaking of transferring yourself.........my son and I were talking about whether or not we would oneday have transporters like on Star Trek. We were going through all the problems with them, like how you would keep unwanted people out of your home, etc. Then we decided there would have to be transporter stations with security so you coulnd't go anywhere you want. He says, "yeah, you could just teleport yourself to the airport whenever you needed to go somewhere." I laughed so hard I almost crashed the car. Then he got it.

Okay, I'm with Sky on the controllable telepathy, but I'd change the body switching to teleporters. I keep going back and forth on this because, personally, I'd love a new body that didn't hold me back the way this one does. But, then I wonder, if we never got sick, would we bother to try taking care of ourselves or would we just abuse the hell out of ourselves until our bodies collapsed and then just get a new one? And, then, we wouldn't actually ever die. We'd just keep putting ourself into a new body here. And, that would probably defeat the whole purpose of our being here in the first place.

But, I would like a teleporter (or transporter or whatever you'd call it). It would make it so easy for me to visit people I met here.

Perhaps there is a perfect universe out there and we so happen to not live in one.

Perhaps this universe is as perfect as it can get.


I think many of the most influential thinkers have thought about it for thousands of years. As they couldn't find ultimate answers many have created stories that soothed the mind and create many followers to believe in it also.

Afterall, most of us would like to go to sleep not worrying about it or at least believing that after we die we could or can go to a better place.

Then of course there are many that are contempt that this life is all that really counts and nothing else happens afterwords.

Whatever the reasons are for our existence we might never know, yet regardless, most of us try to make the best out of it.

One thing is for certain, you will never run out of idealogies of what might be available as a answer. The many different minds at work on this planet can give you many possiblities of what we claim to be true.

I totally see were you're going with this. Teleportation would mean not having to "waste time getting from point A to point B".

So I guess I didn't expand enough on the concept of "designing and creating bodies". If we could design a body that could survive, unassisted in intergalactic space, or in the center of a star? Or that could travel faster than light? (Which would necessitate removing that pesky light speed limitation from the rules of the universe.) In other words, the body itself would be the transporter.

So maybe I should have said "transform" insted of "create".

And just a note here, there is a SciFi book ("The Silkie" by A.E. Van Voght) that postulates exactly such a bodily transformation capability. And there is also another SciFi book/story (I don;t remember where I read it) whose entire premise was about the problems of security inherent in the concept of "personal teleporters".

Really, as I see it, the problems of humanity all boil down to one thing: the limitations of the physical body. If those limitations were removed, then I think most of the problems of humanity would just go poof! About the only problems left would be those inherent in communication.

In other words, the limitations inherent of the body are what limit personal survival and the limitations of communication are what limit interaction with others.

first of all, saying that the universe is seemingly grotesque is a bit presumptuous when we know nothing of it outside of our own solar system.
i will say that if there is intelligent design at work, i have to question the intelligent part. at least for our existence. if there is a supreme being, i think we are just his 6th grade science fair experiment. that or he started playing Sim Earth and left it running while he went outside to have a catch.


. . .

Some people say they can do this with astral projection but I'm not so sure I believe it. Although in this case they leave the body behind. We want something where the whole person goes.

Assumimg you wrote this the way I read it, I agree. Unless you wrote it wrong but I'm still understanding what you meant even though you didn't write it.

I'm not rong that rote it write, so it's write if you think I didn't right it rong. Right?

Based on some of the things I've seen suggested thus far I guess my suggestions would be quite meager. I'm pretty happy with the way things are in general. I like to see only minor improvement in comparison.

A body that remains healthy would be nice. Friendly animals, and humans would be nice. No biting insects and things like that. I have no problem with sharing the world with mosquitoes and such, as long as they don't fly in my face or land on me or my food.

In short, remove hostility, and health problems, and I'm pretty satified with things just as they are.

I guess I'm a low-maintenance human in God's eyes.

Well, I think it would also be cool if horses could talk and actually enjoy pulling farm equipment.

And of course, it would be cool to have horse drawn farm equipment.

That's all I want to do. Just live on a farm and grown my own food and be a vegetarian. I'd be happy. I'd work on mathematics and physics in my spare time. I wouldn't even want to know the answers, that would spoil the fun of discovery.

I guess there is one last thing I'd like to have that would really make it great. I'd like to have the ability to find a compatible mate. And by compatible I simply mean someone who would be just as happy and content as I would be to live on a small farm.

I guess that would be the most difficult miracle for God to pull off. It would be cool to have kids to teach and raise too. But they wouldn't need to be mine. Maybe just an opportunity to be a teacher without restraint (i.e. raise them like they are my own)

I think that would be a great life right there.

But having vistors on occassion would be great too! Ruth could beam over for a visit from time to time, and Sky could skydive down from the sun once in a while in his asbestos body.

Sign me up!

Right!

Beam me up, Abra!

I once knew a thinker name wux
he thought that the universe sucks
if it came from a god,
the design is quite odd
for it's not even close to deluxe

HEY! i GOT IMMORTALIZED BY SOMEONE. I've always wanted to be immortal. Or immoral? It's a toss-up. The second one justifies the first one. Thank you, poet.

How "perfect" should life be before it's so perfect that it's utterly boring and meaningless?

AND I am perfect! Because my life is aleady boring and utterly meaningless.

I've gotta get laid soon, or else I'm gonna go bonkers.

See! No wonder you think life sucks! Better get some imperfections stirred up!




Happy lays are here again
wux will persevere again
banging Gwenivere within
Happy days are here again

I believe there is a world like that. I had a vivid dream of it. The weather was perfect. Food, plentiful. NO war. People made love on giant feather pillows. They lived in roman looking buildings with marble floors. There was no marriage, but there was committed lasting relationships, but they were not monogamous. My mate in that dream looked like a greek god with the statue of David type body, and shoulder length blond hair. His gift to me that day (it was my birthday) was a handsome dark haired man who would make love to me or whatever... and a feast of fruits and wine and bread.

It was a vacation for me. The most wonderful lucid dream I have ever had. But a perfect world like that might really get boring after a few thousand years. People had long life spans there.

Yes, I believe perfect worlds do exist, but I think we need challenges and adventure too. We need games. The sentient life in this universe wants to play games. I believe much of what goes on in the universes are games.

Hey you are responsible for what happens in your life so quit whining. If getting laid is all you need, then hire a professional.

Or get one of those dolls.