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| Topic: Was Cain's curse lifted? | |
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"Your right hand, O LORD, is become glorious in power: your right hand, O LORD, has dashed in pieces the enemy." (King James) "The God of Abraham" is primarily a God of War. Forgiveness and mercy is not something he had a lot of. That's close to being Exodus 15:6, which is still a song written by the Israelites. This is not attributed to God or the angels, so it's simply the Israelites praises for God saving them from Egypt. How you can take a song praising one facet of God's character as proof that God is a God of war would be puzzling, if I thought you cared about intellectual honesty. Well now there are more than just that one little verse that indicates that the God you worship is a man of war. In fact the entire Bible is full of evidence to that. Take the book of Joshua for example. The order from God was to kill without mercy. Some of it is waring, yes this much is true. But nevertheless it was brought on these people by themselves and their choices. It wasn't just God saying "hmm, who to pick on now". And yes, there was mercy. None of this would have happened if these people would have repented from the action(s) they were being punished for and asked for forgiveness. Again, they brought it upon themselves through their stuborness. You once told me that God wanted people to love him and follow him of their own free will. Now you are telling me that because they didn't, they were killed, murdered, or otherwise "punished" for "being stubborn." There is no free will or even freedom in that god's kingdom. He is an angry, jealous, vengeful, merciless, unforgiving, demanding god. |
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Back then, there were other Gods. I don't know who these beings were, but they were at war with each other and they incited their followers to be at war with one another.
For example, there were people who worshiped Baal. That was another god. Jehovah simply killed them for worshiping someone else. |
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"Your right hand, O LORD, is become glorious in power: your right hand, O LORD, has dashed in pieces the enemy." (King James) "The God of Abraham" is primarily a God of War. Forgiveness and mercy is not something he had a lot of. That's close to being Exodus 15:6, which is still a song written by the Israelites. This is not attributed to God or the angels, so it's simply the Israelites praises for God saving them from Egypt. How you can take a song praising one facet of God's character as proof that God is a God of war would be puzzling, if I thought you cared about intellectual honesty. Well now there are more than just that one little verse that indicates that the God you worship is a man of war. In fact the entire Bible is full of evidence to that. Take the book of Joshua for example. The order from God was to kill without mercy. Some of it is waring, yes this much is true. But nevertheless it was brought on these people by themselves and their choices. It wasn't just God saying "hmm, who to pick on now". And yes, there was mercy. None of this would have happened if these people would have repented from the action(s) they were being punished for and asked for forgiveness. Again, they brought it upon themselves through their stuborness. You once told me that God wanted people to love him and follow him of their own free will. Now you are telling me that because they didn't, they were killed, murdered, or otherwise "punished" for "being stubborn." There is no free will or even freedom in that god's kingdom. He is an angry, jealous, vengeful, merciless, unforgiving, demanding god. Oh, but there is free will. Free will amounts to nothing but choice in the action in question. The outcome or results of that action is not part of the free will, it is not something that person(s) controls. If people choose to not worship God, that by all means in their choice. God has told us the result of that action, therefore one could not claim to have been ignorant of the possible outcome. |
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Back then, there were other Gods. I don't know who these beings were, but they were at war with each other and they incited their followers to be at war with one another. For example, there were people who worshiped Baal. That was another god. Jehovah simply killed them for worshiping someone else. Have you read The White Goddess by Robert Graves, gives a good summary (as I recall) |
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Cowboy when someone threatens your life if you don't worship them, that is not allowing them to have free will. That is EXTORTION.
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Back then, there were other Gods. I don't know who these beings were, but they were at war with each other and they incited their followers to be at war with one another. For example, there were people who worshiped Baal. That was another god. Jehovah simply killed them for worshiping someone else. There are many Gods and yet there is one God. Again, "God" means authority. We have been given dominion over the animals eg., we have been given authority over the animals, thus we have been made Gods to the animals. And the reason I said yet there is one God is displayed in the following. Deuteronomy 10:17 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward: |
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Cowboy when someone threatens your life if you don't worship them, that is not allowing them to have free will. That is EXTORTION. We are not threated. One can not be threatened by "religion" or a spiritual essence that is worshipped on faith. One would have to first believe before that belief would ever have any effect on that person. We worship out of love, out of wishing to, not out of being "threatened". Not to gain any door prize or reward for ourselves. We worship because we love God and want to give him thanks for his love. |
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If people choose to not worship God, that by all means in their choice. God has told us the result of that action, therefore one could not claim to have been ignorant of the possible outcome. Correction: Your god, the god of war, Jehovah, the jealous god, has told you what he will do to you if you "disobey" him or worship another god. He has said he will kill you. He has said that to disobey him is a sin and "the wages of sin is death." He has said that if you disobey him you will die. So, according to you if a person does not worship this war god, it is their own fault if they get killed. And now you people want to try to claim that Jehovah, Yahweh or what ever you call him.... is a merciful and forgiving god? No he isn't. He is a jealous, vengeful unforgiving, merciless god. |
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If I am correct, then this is the first example of God's mercy in the Bible. And goes further to show that the God of Abraham is forgiving and merciful. Does anyone else have any opinion on this? I feel I should remind you that you asked if anyone had an opinion on this. I think that occasionally that god may have shown some mercy, but that mercy and forgiveness was not something that came easy for him. I asked for opinions. Your opinion is fine, just don't try to support it with fake scriptures. |
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Cowboy when someone threatens your life if you don't worship them, that is not allowing them to have free will. That is EXTORTION. We are not threated. One can not be threatened by "religion" or a spiritual essence that is worshipped on faith. One would have to first believe before that belief would ever have any effect on that person. We worship out of love, out of wishing to, not out of being "threatened". Not to gain any door prize or reward for ourselves. We worship because we love God and want to give him thanks for his love. I am referring to the people he had killed in the past stories in the Bible. You feel they died because they disobeyed or because they worshiped another god. Right? Extortion. |
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If I am correct, then this is the first example of God's mercy in the Bible. And goes further to show that the God of Abraham is forgiving and merciful. Does anyone else have any opinion on this? I feel I should remind you that you asked if anyone had an opinion on this. I think that occasionally that god may have shown some mercy, but that mercy and forgiveness was not something that came easy for him. I asked for opinions. Your opinion is fine, just don't try to support it with fake scriptures. As far as I am concerned all of the scriptures are fake. |
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If people choose to not worship God, that by all means in their choice. God has told us the result of that action, therefore one could not claim to have been ignorant of the possible outcome. Correction: Your god, the god of war, Jehovah, the jealous god, has told you what he will do to you if you "disobey" him or worship another god. He has said he will kill you. He has said that to disobey him is a sin and "the wages of sin is death." He has said that if you disobey him you will die. So, according to you if a person does not worship this war god, it is their own fault if they get killed. And now you people want to try to claim that Jehovah, Yahweh or what ever you call him.... is a merciful and forgiving god? No he isn't. He is a jealous, vengeful unforgiving, merciless god. Yes and I am glad he has told us. It would not be righteous of him to punish us for something we did not know we were doing wrong. That is why our God is a righteous God. He has told us what is wrong and what the outcome of embarking on those actions would be. But yet, even us having been told this and committ(ed) them, he is still willing to forgive us out trespasses. God is ever loving. |
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Cowboy when someone threatens your life if you don't worship them, that is not allowing them to have free will. That is EXTORTION. We are not threated. One can not be threatened by "religion" or a spiritual essence that is worshipped on faith. One would have to first believe before that belief would ever have any effect on that person. We worship out of love, out of wishing to, not out of being "threatened". Not to gain any door prize or reward for ourselves. We worship because we love God and want to give him thanks for his love. I am referring to the people he had killed in the past stories in the Bible. You feel they died because they disobeyed or because they worshiped another god. Right? Extortion. How is that blackmail? God has told us not to worship anything other then him, and the outcome of it. So these people shouldn't have been surprised when it happened. |
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Back then, there were other Gods. I don't know who these beings were, but they were at war with each other and they incited their followers to be at war with one another. For example, there were people who worshiped Baal. That was another god. Jehovah simply killed them for worshiping someone else. There are many Gods and yet there is one God. Again, "God" means authority. We have been given dominion over the animals eg., we have been given authority over the animals, thus we have been made Gods to the animals. And the reason I said yet there is one God is displayed in the following. Deuteronomy 10:17 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward: Cowboy please don't attempt to define, for me, what the term "God" means. In the Bible, there is a specific God that is referred to as "The God of Abraham" and he is a god of war and he does battle against other gods -- also mentioned in the Bible. It is that specific God of the Jews that is written about in the Bible, that we are talking about. |
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Cowboy when someone threatens your life if you don't worship them, that is not allowing them to have free will. That is EXTORTION. We are not threated. One can not be threatened by "religion" or a spiritual essence that is worshipped on faith. One would have to first believe before that belief would ever have any effect on that person. We worship out of love, out of wishing to, not out of being "threatened". Not to gain any door prize or reward for ourselves. We worship because we love God and want to give him thanks for his love. I am referring to the people he had killed in the past stories in the Bible. You feel they died because they disobeyed or because they worshiped another god. Right? Extortion. How is that blackmail? God has told us not to worship anything other then him, and the outcome of it. So these people shouldn't have been surprised when it happened. It is not blackmail, it is Extortion. Extortion is a threat. If I choose not to worship this God of War, and he threatens to kill me, that is extortion. It is a threat. I am a free soul. I have free will. I do not or will not bow to any entity who claims to be the almighty god and demands to be worshiped or to any entity who does so with threats of violence on my person or on my soul. That is a sure sign that he is a false god. |
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Back then, there were other Gods. I don't know who these beings were, but they were at war with each other and they incited their followers to be at war with one another. For example, there were people who worshiped Baal. That was another god. Jehovah simply killed them for worshiping someone else. There are many Gods and yet there is one God. Again, "God" means authority. We have been given dominion over the animals eg., we have been given authority over the animals, thus we have been made Gods to the animals. And the reason I said yet there is one God is displayed in the following. Deuteronomy 10:17 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward: Cowboy please don't attempt to define, for me, what the term "God" means. In the Bible, there is a specific God that is referred to as "The God of Abraham" and he is a god of war and he does battle against other gods -- also mentioned in the Bible. It is that specific God of the Jews that is written about in the Bible, that we are talking about. Yes he is referred to as God of Abraham, he is referred to as such because Abraham acknowledged him as God. That is in referance to the same God as any other mentioning of "God" in the scriptures. Yes he is a God of gods and does rage war against those whom are disobedient. "I have said ye are Gods and children of the most high". I'm not defining anything for you. The merriam webster dictionary is - : a person or thing of supreme value : a powerful ruler |
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Cowboy when someone threatens your life if you don't worship them, that is not allowing them to have free will. That is EXTORTION. We are not threated. One can not be threatened by "religion" or a spiritual essence that is worshipped on faith. One would have to first believe before that belief would ever have any effect on that person. We worship out of love, out of wishing to, not out of being "threatened". Not to gain any door prize or reward for ourselves. We worship because we love God and want to give him thanks for his love. I am referring to the people he had killed in the past stories in the Bible. You feel they died because they disobeyed or because they worshiped another god. Right? Extortion. How is that blackmail? God has told us not to worship anything other then him, and the outcome of it. So these people shouldn't have been surprised when it happened. It is not blackmail, it is Extortion. Extortion is a threat. If I choose not to worship this God of War, and he threatens to kill me, that is extortion. It is a threat. I am a free soul. I have free will. I do not or will not bow to any entity who claims to be the almighty god and demands to be worshiped or to any entity who does so with threats of violence on my person or on my soul. That is a sure sign that he is a false god. It is no threat. And according to the definition of extortion, there was no extortion going on anywhere. None of this is for God to gain anything esp, money, or anything of such. And there is no threats. God doesn't threaten anyone with death. Death is the automatic ending of life. God offers eternal life and a way to live beyond the grave through his great merci. Noun: The practice of obtaining something, esp. money, through force or threats. Synonyms: blackmail - exaction |
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Your understanding of the term "God" is different than mine, probably different than a lot of people's.
But in this thread Spider is specifically talking about the Jewish "God of Abraham" that is described and talked about in the Jewish scriptures. You will be getting off topic if you start going into your own personal scripture and belief about God. I'm just trying to stay on topic. |
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Edited by
Jeanniebean
on
Wed 06/13/12 06:59 PM
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Cowboy, by your own excuses that you gave for the reason those people in the Bible were all slaughtered without mercy..by order of YOUR GOD, because they refused to worship the God of Abraham and instead worshiped Baal.
That is EXTORTION. They were warned and that warning was a threat. And so you say it was their own fault.  It was their own fault because they refused to be intimidated and threatened by some entity that was claiming to be the almighty god and demanding to be worshiped. That is proof to me that Jehovah is a false god. |
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Your understanding of the term "God" is different than mine, probably different than a lot of people's. But in this thread Spider is specifically talking about the Jewish "God of Abraham" that is described and talked about in the Jewish scriptures. You will be getting off topic if you start going into your own personal scripture and belief about God. I'm just trying to stay on topic. Do what now? The definition for the word "God" is as shown. It is defined that way in every dictionary. Doesn't matter if the word is being used to refer to God of Abraham, God of mars, or God of Venus. The word means the same exact thing. It is a title showing power and authority. Nothing has gone off topic till this post and your post. So, yes I agree stay on topic. This is my last post in this specific off topic discussion. |
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