Gosh, what a surprise!

I was just thinking this morning about people who claim to be "saved" and are so elated about it. I started wondering just what it was that they feel they have been "saved" from?

Then I turned on my computer and read this thread. Now I think I understand. Religious fanatics like Pat Robertson have obviously convinced people that God is out to destroy them. So he scares them into accepting Jesus as their "Savior" and now the reason those people are so elated is because they have convinced themselves that God is no longer out to get them.

So this evil God is going to destroy an entire nation just because a very small minority of people prefer to love and marry someone of their same gender?

I totally agree with Kleisto. Such at God would be utterly insane and totally undependable. Obviously, according to Pat Robertson God would take out his anger and wrath on a entire nation people just to spite a few people who happen to fall in love with their own gender.

~~~~~

By the way, whoever wrote Ezekiel must have been one hell of a troubled and sick person. That book contains some serious psychosis and paranoia. Whoever wrote it was trying to make God out to be a truly hateful intolerant jerk.

It's no wonder people feel a need to be "saved" after reading that kind of derogatory crap. Real very much of that and a person could easily be convinced that God hates them for merely having been born.

Is there anywhere in the Bible where God actually praises anyone?

I mean more than just a few individuals?

He certainly didn't seem to praise Noah, or Job.

Was this God pleased with anyone outside of Jesus?

The more I read the Bible the more difficult it is to imagine that God being pleased with anyone but himself. In fact, he doesn't even seem to be a very happy God. Based on his attitude he even appears to be totally unhappy even with himself.

It's pretty sad picture of a God if you ask me. A God who has to threaten people with horrible punishment if they refuse to LOVE and obey him?

That's about as pathetic as a God can be isn't it?

If I thought God was that dastardly I guess I'd feel a desperate need to be "Saved" too.

But what sense does it even make to be 'saved' by such an evil deity?

That would be like being 'saved' by Hitler because you finally confess that HIS WILL BE DONE.



And you had NO OTHER CHOICE! Lest he be extremely MEAN to you!

This seriously has to be the most dastardly picture of a creator that mankind has ever created in his sick demented mind.

I seriously believe that we would be hard-pressed to find an uglier picture of a God anywhere on planet Earth.

Even Zeus has better qualities. At least Zeus wasn't a male-chauvinist pig, and I don't think he was all that jealous either. There were many Gods and Goddesses in that picture of spirituality.

But Yahweh is jealous, selfish, male-chauvinistic, and obviously quite mean and hateful toward anyone who isn't absolutely PERFECT in every way.

What a jerk.

I'm actually elated to know that it's just a man-made horror story.

I guess that's how I got "saved" from it.

I simply recognized that it's nothing more than an evil story created by ignorant men.

So I guess I feel just as elated as anyone who feels that they were 'saved'. They convinced themselves that God no longer hates them.

Well, so did I.

I just achieved that result in a different way. I totally dismissed the hateful stories of a hateful God.

Now there simply isn't anything to be 'saved' from anymore.

SAVE YOURSELF! Burn your Bible!

I can't understand why anyone would worship a god like that.

Truly.

I mean, in all seriousness, I can see people wanting to believe in spirituality and eternal life. And I can even understand people wanting to believe that there exists an all-wise supreme being who knows everything and can answer all their questions and explain everything after they die.

I can truly understand people's desire for this.

And there are ideas in some of the biblical stories that could have been made into a beautiful picture of spirituality. But there's also a whole lot of hate, bigotry and religious intolerance. Not to mention the obvious male-chauvinism etc.

I mean a God who would make childbirth painful as some sort of "punishment" for women?

That's just about as sick and demented as it can get right there.

To want to believe in a God is one thing. I can understand that with no problem. I like to believe in magick too! And that's all a belief in God truly is. God would be nothing more than the ultimate magician.

Wanting to believe in a cosmic eternal magician who is totally benevolent and righteous is one thing. Supporting that the biblical cannon of stories is the verbatim work, commandments, thoughts, and desires of such a God is just totally insane, IMHO. It's filled with truly ugly and negative crap, IMHO.

Unfortunately so many people have been convinced that this absurd collection of stories represents "God's Word".

That's the disturbing part. Don't they realize that it was just men who decided which stories to include in this cannon?

I personally think they made some really poor choices concerning what to include in their religious cannon that they artificially built and called "The Word of God".

That's all the Bible is. A collection of stories that various men decided to put together and proclaim that what they put together should be viewed as "The Word of God".

Hell's bells' if anyone did that today no one would take them seriously!

So why the hell are they taking it so seriously just because this was done by ancient men?

If people want to believe in a God surely they can find better pictures to believe in.

I know I did!

so if there is a god, and he is against it, why? wouldn't there be a reason behind it?

According to the Bible, God created men and women to be matching pairs. Men are made for women and vise versa. So homosexuality goes against his plan for humanity.

huh... so homos are kind of like a rebel teenager then...

That doesn't make any sense to me.

Given any human culture there simply isn't always an exact 50/50 mix of males and females. So it cannot have been God's plan that everyone pair up.

In fact, if we accept your assumption that it is God's plan for everyone to pair up and he clearly did not provide a way for there to be precisely the same amount of males and females in a culture, then obviously he must have intended for some same-gender couples to pair up.

So your argument actually supports that it is obviously God's plan for same-gender couples to exist.

No, that's what Pat Robertson, some Christians and most non-Christians are mistaken on. Jesus taught that we are all rebel children, not that some of us are good and some are bad. Jesus said that we are all disobedient and need forgiveness. I'm no more or less sinful than the average homosexual. My job is to show homosexuals the love that Jesus has for them, not condemn or judge.

There you go with your sloppy thinking again. You ignore a multitude of possibilities to come up with the conclusion you want to be true. You'll never find true happiness until you stop following your heart and instead follow the facts where ever they lead.

But Jesus didn't teach against homosexuality.

Which has what to do with my post?

My sloppy thinking?

I beg your pardon sir, but you are the one who is ignoring the TRUTH.

The TRUTH is that it is seldom the case that there are equal numbers of males and females in a given culture.

Therefore it cannot have been God's plan for all couples to be heterosexual. The means to that end is simply not possible.

A God cannot expect humans to achieve results that he did not provide them the means to achieve.

Therefore your claim is unreasonable and cannot stand.

"Mark 7:15 There is NOTHING from without a man, that entering into him can defile him:"


looks to me jesus had no problem with homosexuals and has broken the kosher laws,just sayin

Also note that according to GOD homosexuality is an abomination

Well you said that it's your "job" to show homosexuals the love that Jesus has for them.

Has it ever dawned on you that maybe homosexuals already know that Jesus loves them just as they are?

The ratio of men to women have absolutely nothing to do with this. There may be more women then men, but look around and see how many single men there are. Don't know if the ratio still stands, but there once was 7 women to every 1 man. If this was true, not saying it wasn't, but if this was true, then why would there be single men? What would be the need for homosexual men? And with the mass amount of single men, what would be the need for homosexual women because there is obviously many single men with this ratio. There is no need for homosexuality, homosexuality benefits nothing. The only thing is benefits is on a selfish level of sexual desire. It does not reproduce, and that is what sexual actions is for. Outside of reproduction sex has absolutely no place on this Earth.

it's your job to teach that?

Jesus does love them, Jesus loves murderers, he loves adulterers, he loves rapists, he loves EVERYONE. He does not love these "actions" but the person he does. That is why he offers a way to turn from these actions and be forgiven for their previous mistakes without a catch. Jesus loves all.

so it is like the sheepherder that wants to make sure his flocks are plentiful, so he has more wool and meat for the sale... he won't have plentiful herds if they all turned gay....

That's true.



This conclusion is not supported by the single point of data that you offered.

Alternatives:

1) God wanted single people to move from one city to another to further spread their genes.
2) There are more men, because they will fight in wars, are more reckless when their safety is on the line and men are more likely to be killed while working or simply living. If the excess men are killed off, then it reduces the chances that a woman won't find a husband.
3) Some people have no interest in marriage, so God planned accordingly by providing more of that gender.
4) The fallen nature of the universe has changed the ratio of the genders, which is part of our punishment for our sins.

Get the point? You are stuck on the single alternative that you prefer, you don't even look at other possibilities.