100% FREE ONLINE DATING
sponsored links
|
|
|
CowboyGH - Insisting that your religious beliefs take precedence over the choices these young girls may make shows a complete lack of empathy for the horrors these girls have endured. They and only they should be the ones to make such decisions and frankly it is none of your business. I understand where you're coming from, you just don't seem to see where I'm coming from. - Is that fetus not a living being? - Does that fetus not have life? If either of those are a yes, then who's right is it for anyone to take it away? Even if the parent didn't intend to be impregnated for any number of reasons. That child's life is not a possession, it does not belong to the mother. yes it does, until it's an adult... your trying to force women to have babies they might not be able to afford, deal with, or even want... so much for god letting people make their OWN decisions... No it doesn't. A baby's life is just that, the baby's life. The baby is not a possession, a thing, or an object. Not trying to force anyone to do anything, if they did not wish to get impregnated they should not have been having sex. If it was from rape, can always put the child up for adoption. As life begins at conception. So again, how can anyone have control over if someone keeps their life or looses it especially when they've done absolutely nothing to influence the possibility of either choices? well, the law says your wrong... does god teach this baby or does the mother? if something happens to the baby, is god going to jail? is god paying for everything for the baby? Wasn't speaking of man's law. That living being inside a mother is just that, a living being. Weather it can feel or not, even if it won't ever know what's happening to it. Doesn't matter, bottom line is it's taking the life of another. That's why they allow abortion up to a certain amount of weeks, till then the fetus/baby wouldn't feel it. But that's not the point again weather if it can feel it or not, it's taking the life of a living soul. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
The heart does not develop till five weeks . A fetus does not become viable till 24 weeks . . Meaning until this point it is unlikely to survive outside of the womb . How do you suggest we determine what the fetus wants .. Laughing . You assume the choice would be life . A woman has a right to choose to conceive or not .. .. These girls had no such right . Now you want to force them to give birth and raise a child conceived by rape .. Are you for real . There comes a point when religion has no say . ...And should remain silent . They deserve to make the choice and not to be judged . I am sure god will be sympathetic if he truly is a just and loving god . It may not have a heart at that time. But more then likely it will have a heart. So doesn't really matter if the operation is done before the heart is visible or not it would still be the taking of someones life. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
CowboyGH - Insisting that your religious beliefs take precedence over the choices these young girls may make shows a complete lack of empathy for the horrors these girls have endured. They and only they should be the ones to make such decisions and frankly it is none of your business. I understand where you're coming from, you just don't seem to see where I'm coming from. - Is that fetus not a living being? - Does that fetus not have life? If either of those are a yes, then who's right is it for anyone to take it away? Even if the parent didn't intend to be impregnated for any number of reasons. That child's life is not a possession, it does not belong to the mother. yes it does, until it's an adult... your trying to force women to have babies they might not be able to afford, deal with, or even want... so much for god letting people make their OWN decisions... No it doesn't. A baby's life is just that, the baby's life. The baby is not a possession, a thing, or an object. Not trying to force anyone to do anything, if they did not wish to get impregnated they should not have been having sex. If it was from rape, can always put the child up for adoption. As life begins at conception. So again, how can anyone have control over if someone keeps their life or looses it especially when they've done absolutely nothing to influence the possibility of either choices? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As I stated earlier, the Bible does not specifically address the topic of abortion. However, the Torah addresses the issue of causing a pregnant woman to have a miscarriage (Exodus 21:22). In such a case, the Torah does not treat the miscarriage as a death. Abortion is intentionally causing a miscarriage. Maybe not physically hitting/harming the child in exacts. But killing the living soul being. read what he wrote again... and he shall pay as the judges determine. So it's still saying that it is wrong and not condoning this method of "abortion". your the one doing the judging... read what happiness2u wrote, that pretty much sums it up... Excuse me? I judged no one. Did I ever in any instance say anyone was lesser? Or make any derogatory statement on anyone's salvation? Secondly Exodus 21:22 22 If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. The "abortion" method did not go unpunished. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
CowboyGH - Insisting that your religious beliefs take precedence over the choices these young girls may make shows a complete lack of empathy for the horrors these girls have endured. They and only they should be the ones to make such decisions and frankly it is none of your business. I understand where you're coming from, you just don't seem to see where I'm coming from. - Is that fetus not a living being? - Does that fetus not have life? If either of those are a yes, then who's right is it for anyone to take it away? Even if the parent didn't intend to be impregnated for any number of reasons. That child's life is not a possession, it does not belong to the mother. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As I stated earlier, the Bible does not specifically address the topic of abortion. However, the Torah addresses the issue of causing a pregnant woman to have a miscarriage (Exodus 21:22). In such a case, the Torah does not treat the miscarriage as a death. Abortion is intentionally causing a miscarriage. Maybe not physically hitting/harming the child in exacts. But killing the living soul being. read what he wrote again... and he shall pay as the judges determine. So it's still saying that it is wrong and not condoning this method of "abortion". |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As I stated earlier, the Bible does not specifically address the topic of abortion. However, the Torah addresses the issue of causing a pregnant woman to have a miscarriage (Exodus 21:22). In such a case, the Torah does not treat the miscarriage as a death. Abortion is intentionally causing a miscarriage. Maybe not physically hitting/harming the child in exacts. But killing the living soul being. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As I stated earlier, the Bible does not specifically address the topic of abortion. However, the Torah addresses the issue of causing a pregnant woman to have a miscarriage (Exodus 21:22). In such a case, the Torah does not treat the miscarriage as a death. Thou shalt not murder ;) As I stated earlier, the Bible does not specifically address the topic of abortion. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
there is legal and illegal, which is based only on the law there are religious laws where illegal is called 'sin' there are mans laws where illegal is called 'criminal' there is right and wrong, and then beyond all that there is understandable and unreasonable people can do things wrong, criminal, and sinful, but understandable because they are human and emotional and taking the 'right' path is sometimes very hard I believe the original question is about right and wrong and in a religious thread, is being asked in the context of religious law,,,, in which case, because abortion is mentioned only in the sense that God knows us BEFORE we are in the womb, most following religous doctrine consider life in the womb Gods creation and only Gods to take,,, it is not as clear and direct as though shall not commit adultery , for instance, so there will always be debate Again, the taking the life of another is just that. The taking the life of another. What's it truly matter if it's a fetus, a baby, a toddler, a teenager, a grown person, or an elderly? It's still that person's own life to live. i would argue they aren't people till they take their first breath... How are they not a "people"? What makes them change into a "people" at birth? What's the difference between the being inside the woman or the being outside the woman? just a difference of opinion, nothing more... if a fetus hasn't had a life, no thoughts, seen nothing, tasted nothing, probably can hear things, but can't possibly understand what it is hearing, how is that alive? it's heart is beating, not much else going on... When a doctor checks to see if a patient is alive, do they check the heartbeat? Or do they check to see if the person is thinking, seeing, tasting, or hearing? And there may not be a physical "heart" when the baby is in the early stages of being a fetus, but with the assumption the delivery will be a success *which is unknown from the start either way* then why is it not treated as it does have a heartbeat? As it's still a living soul at conception. going to a doctor and coming out of a womb are two different things... when a child comes out of the womb, thats when it starts learning, seeing, eating, hearing and comprehending... someone going to a doctor has been doing all these for a while... No sir, that child is learning much longer then at birth. Maybe not actual things such a politics, weather, about the stars, ect. But it is learning and that never stops until the person's life is over. What's it matter if they've been doing it for a while or just started? Why is one more prevalent and more dominate then the other? And therefore my valuable then the other? And again truly answer me this question, if the mother has the choice to take the child's life before birth, why does she no longer have that choice later on? years maybe? What change is there? How is that life any more "valuable" then before, and why was it less of value before? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Edited by
CowboyGH
on
Thu 05/07/15 09:04 PM
|
|
there is legal and illegal, which is based only on the law there are religious laws where illegal is called 'sin' there are mans laws where illegal is called 'criminal' there is right and wrong, and then beyond all that there is understandable and unreasonable people can do things wrong, criminal, and sinful, but understandable because they are human and emotional and taking the 'right' path is sometimes very hard I believe the original question is about right and wrong and in a religious thread, is being asked in the context of religious law,,,, in which case, because abortion is mentioned only in the sense that God knows us BEFORE we are in the womb, most following religous doctrine consider life in the womb Gods creation and only Gods to take,,, it is not as clear and direct as though shall not commit adultery , for instance, so there will always be debate Again, the taking the life of another is just that. The taking the life of another. What's it truly matter if it's a fetus, a baby, a toddler, a teenager, a grown person, or an elderly? It's still that person's own life to live. i would argue they aren't people till they take their first breath... How are they not a "people"? What makes them change into a "people" at birth? What's the difference between the being inside the woman or the being outside the woman? just a difference of opinion, nothing more... if a fetus hasn't had a life, no thoughts, seen nothing, tasted nothing, probably can hear things, but can't possibly understand what it is hearing, how is that alive? it's heart is beating, not much else going on... When a doctor checks to see if a patient is alive, do they check the heartbeat? Or do they check to see if the person is thinking, seeing, tasting, or hearing? And there may not be a physical "heart" when the baby is in the early stages of being a fetus, but with the assumption the delivery will be a success *which is unknown from the start either way* then why is it not treated as it does have a heartbeat? As it's still a living soul at conception. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
there is legal and illegal, which is based only on the law there are religious laws where illegal is called 'sin' there are mans laws where illegal is called 'criminal' there is right and wrong, and then beyond all that there is understandable and unreasonable people can do things wrong, criminal, and sinful, but understandable because they are human and emotional and taking the 'right' path is sometimes very hard I believe the original question is about right and wrong and in a religious thread, is being asked in the context of religious law,,,, in which case, because abortion is mentioned only in the sense that God knows us BEFORE we are in the womb, most following religous doctrine consider life in the womb Gods creation and only Gods to take,,, it is not as clear and direct as though shall not commit adultery , for instance, so there will always be debate Again, the taking the life of another is just that. The taking the life of another. What's it truly matter if it's a fetus, a baby, a toddler, a teenager, a grown person, or an elderly? It's still that person's own life to live. i would argue they aren't people till they take their first breath... How are they not a "people"? What makes them change into a "people" at birth? What's the difference between the being inside the woman or the being outside the woman? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
there is legal and illegal, which is based only on the law there are religious laws where illegal is called 'sin' there are mans laws where illegal is called 'criminal' there is right and wrong, and then beyond all that there is understandable and unreasonable people can do things wrong, criminal, and sinful, but understandable because they are human and emotional and taking the 'right' path is sometimes very hard I believe the original question is about right and wrong and in a religious thread, is being asked in the context of religious law,,,, in which case, because abortion is mentioned only in the sense that God knows us BEFORE we are in the womb, most following religous doctrine consider life in the womb Gods creation and only Gods to take,,, it is not as clear and direct as though shall not commit adultery , for instance, so there will always be debate all laws, sins or whatever aside, i'm just pointing out my opinions on this... seems more logical for the woman to have ALL the decision making power, since she has to be responsible for the children till they are grown... Again, how does she have all the decision making power? It is not her life, not her soul, not her body, not her anything in that context. Yes, it's her child. But children are not objects or things a person can do anything they wish with. It is still a living soul, in her, or after the child comes out. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
there is legal and illegal, which is based only on the law there are religious laws where illegal is called 'sin' there are mans laws where illegal is called 'criminal' there is right and wrong, and then beyond all that there is understandable and unreasonable people can do things wrong, criminal, and sinful, but understandable because they are human and emotional and taking the 'right' path is sometimes very hard I believe the original question is about right and wrong and in a religious thread, is being asked in the context of religious law,,,, in which case, because abortion is mentioned only in the sense that God knows us BEFORE we are in the womb, most following religous doctrine consider life in the womb Gods creation and only Gods to take,,, it is not as clear and direct as though shall not commit adultery , for instance, so there will always be debate Again, the taking the life of another is just that. The taking the life of another. What's it truly matter if it's a fetus, a baby, a toddler, a teenager, a grown person, or an elderly? It's still that person's own life to live. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I rest my case What did the child do to deserve such a punishment? If nothing, then why is the child punished for something someone else did? Where's the justification in that? I didn't say right or wrong. You have no clue the nightmare it would be. Right or wrong, it's for God to judge not you When a man gets pregnant from rape, then I will listen Again, it's not the woman's life being taken away we're talking about here. It's about the little child inside of her that has absolutely nothing to do with how it was created. And abortion is murdering that child before again it does anything whatsoever and will never experience life's experiences. And only ever have experience of being murdered through the abortion. For again the baby did absolutely nothing to deserve the death penalty. And the "the baby doesn't feel it" doesn't justify it, for that execution will keep that child from ever experiencing anything in this world good or bad and even down to again feeling the grass between their twos or the wind on their face. Just because someone decided their life wasn't worth anything because of the way it was made. so the woman has a choice - get raped or die, and your talking about the life of something that not really even alive? the woman had NO choice, but yet your saying she should continue to have NO choice in whether to keep it or not? you say yourself that all people have choices, but yet here you are saying we/women don't have a choice... no wonder people can't grasp the ridiculousness of religion.... the moral codes were broken when the poor women were kidnapped and raped, and yet here you are glorifying god by saying it's not their place to have an option of abortion?? why don't you go to Nigeria and take care of these 200 kids? feed them, cloth them, buy everything they need for the next 15 years... god wants you to do this... he woman had NO choice, but yet your saying she should continue to have NO choice in whether to keep it or not? So your saying a child's life is no more important then say a vehicle someone doesn't wish to "keep"? The child isn't their's to "keep". That child has a life all in it's own, yes that baby child will depend on someone(s) for a time being while they grow up due to ignorance of the world. But none the less in speaking of a "life" isn't their's just as much valuable as any other's? So why should the mother have the "choice" to end "another's" life before they can do anything in it? Again, that baby's life isn't their mother's possession, nor the dad's, nor anyone else's but their own. not a child, it's a fetus... and it's not up to me to decide, it's up to the woman to decide.. my whole point is that it really doesn't matter what me or you think, we will never be put in that position, so we should honor what the woman wants.... and in this case, schoolchildren... you really think you know better than the woman on this matter? A fetus is just as much a child as the one crawling around on the ground, or crying in their cribs, or anything. Again, how is it up to the woman if the baby keeps their life or looses it before doing anything to influence either decision on the case? so we should honor what the woman wants So what would the baby want? As again, that's whom we're discussing, the baby's life, not the woman's. A baby is not a "possession", is not a "thing" or an "object". It is an entire singular being just as you or I. So if the mother gets to choose over the baby's life in pregnancy, why is she not allowed ability to choose life or death over the child at a later date? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I am not in favor of forcing those particular pregnant girls to conform to the religious beliefs of a third party that doesn't even live in their nation. Also, it is the state that determines which killings are murder and which killings aren't. So, has the government of Nigeria declared abortion to be murder? Doesn't really matter if the government of Nigeria deemed it "lawful" to "murder" the fetus. It's again not their possession, nor their life to choose if the baby keeps it or not. It's not about "religion" when it boils down to it. The mother got raped, is a true tragedy. But why should the child be punished for it? Especially when the child in no which way or other had any influence on the decision? Who has the right to choose weather another living, breathing, human being looses their life or not. Especially once again when the "person" in question has done literally absolutely nothing to deserve it. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I rest my case What did the child do to deserve such a punishment? If nothing, then why is the child punished for something someone else did? Where's the justification in that? I didn't say right or wrong. You have no clue the nightmare it would be. Right or wrong, it's for God to judge not you When a man gets pregnant from rape, then I will listen Again, it's not the woman's life being taken away we're talking about here. It's about the little child inside of her that has absolutely nothing to do with how it was created. And abortion is murdering that child before again it does anything whatsoever and will never experience life's experiences. And only ever have experience of being murdered through the abortion. For again the baby did absolutely nothing to deserve the death penalty. And the "the baby doesn't feel it" doesn't justify it, for that execution will keep that child from ever experiencing anything in this world good or bad and even down to again feeling the grass between their twos or the wind on their face. Just because someone decided their life wasn't worth anything because of the way it was made. so the woman has a choice - get raped or die, and your talking about the life of something that not really even alive? the woman had NO choice, but yet your saying she should continue to have NO choice in whether to keep it or not? you say yourself that all people have choices, but yet here you are saying we/women don't have a choice... no wonder people can't grasp the ridiculousness of religion.... the moral codes were broken when the poor women were kidnapped and raped, and yet here you are glorifying god by saying it's not their place to have an option of abortion?? why don't you go to Nigeria and take care of these 200 kids? feed them, cloth them, buy everything they need for the next 15 years... god wants you to do this... he woman had NO choice, but yet your saying she should continue to have NO choice in whether to keep it or not? So your saying a child's life is no more important then say a vehicle someone doesn't wish to "keep"? The child isn't their's to "keep". That child has a life all in it's own, yes that baby child will depend on someone(s) for a time being while they grow up due to ignorance of the world. But none the less in speaking of a "life" isn't their's just as much valuable as any other's? So why should the mother have the "choice" to end "another's" life before they can do anything in it? Again, that baby's life isn't their mother's possession, nor the dad's, nor anyone else's but their own. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I rest my case What did the child do to deserve such a punishment? If nothing, then why is the child punished for something someone else did? Where's the justification in that? I didn't say right or wrong. You have no clue the nightmare it would be. Right or wrong, it's for God to judge not you When a man gets pregnant from rape, then I will listen Again, it's not the woman's life being taken away we're talking about here. It's about the little child inside of her that has absolutely nothing to do with how it was created. And abortion is murdering that child before again it does anything whatsoever and will never experience life's experiences. And only ever have experience of being murdered through the abortion. For again the baby did absolutely nothing to deserve the death penalty. And the "the baby doesn't feel it" doesn't justify it, for that execution will keep that child from ever experiencing anything in this world good or bad and even down to again feeling the grass between their twos or the wind on their face. Just because someone decided their life wasn't worth anything because of the way it was made. I didn't say that at all! A woman's life is in a sense taken away! Right or wrong it is for God to judge. Humans aren't God! Yes, woman's life is "in a sense taken away", the baby's life is literally taken away. No we aren't God, so why is it our discretion to say if the child lives or dies? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I rest my case What did the child do to deserve such a punishment? If nothing, then why is the child punished for something someone else did? Where's the justification in that? I didn't say right or wrong. You have no clue the nightmare it would be. Right or wrong, it's for God to judge not you When a man gets pregnant from rape, then I will listen Again, it's not the woman's life being taken away we're talking about here. It's about the little child inside of her that has absolutely nothing to do with how it was created. And abortion is murdering that child before again it does anything whatsoever and will never experience life's experiences. And only ever have experience of being murdered through the abortion. For again the baby did absolutely nothing to deserve the death penalty. And the "the baby doesn't feel it" doesn't justify it, for that execution will keep that child from ever experiencing anything in this world good or bad and even down to again feeling the grass between their twos or the wind on their face. Just because someone decided their life wasn't worth anything because of the way it was made. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I rest my case What did the child do to deserve such a punishment? If nothing, then why is the child punished for something someone else did? Where's the justification in that? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
How can men who can't possibly understand rape pregnancy judge? When you are in this situation, then I will listen. Until then only God will judge. Leave it between the woman and God. Rape victims have a hard enough time without judgemental people that have no idea what they are going through You're looking at it from the woman's perspective. Yes it would be a hard "burden" to bare. But this is still a being's life we're speaking of. Regardless if that "fetus" can feel the pain or not. It's taking SOMEBODY'S life away from them before they have a chance to live it again never experiencing anything good or bad. And bottom line it's unjustifiable therefor murder. As there is no justifiable reason to take the life of an entirely innocent life over any case... please give a case where it's justifiable to take the life of a being that hasn't done anything at all possible to deserve such a thing. Well of course I am looking at it from a woman's perspective! 1. I am a woman 2. I have had a child 3. My son is a product of a date rape. What are your qualifications? Men have no clue! Yes some can be sympathetic but can't possibly know. Have you been raped? Have you been pregnant? Have you gotten pregnant from a rape? I think I am more qualified to speak on the matter than men. Can you imagine what a victim goes through carrying the baby? Right or wrong she went through hell and a bawy will remind her. If she can keep it or adopt it and carry on with her life...bless her. But many can't Leave it up to God to judge! No I have not been raped, nor pregnant, nor combination of either. But nevertheless it isn't mine nor your choice on the matter, for he is greater. Adoption would always be a choice if you didn't wish to keep the child after a rape. But it's not the child's fault for how he/she was "birthed", so why punish the child and refuse her/him any chance to ever experience anything of life? Good, bad, happy, sad, and or any combination of any. That child isn't a "piece of property" somebody is never in the "possession" of another person, and therefore no one has any power over if you live/exist or not. He is greater and He knows. Let Him judge! I don't see the connection between the woman having had a major trauma happen to her and punishing a child to never experiencing anything in life, but ending their life as soon as it was possibly going to start. |
|
|
|
|
Previous
