Community > Posts By > madisonman

 
madisonman's photo
Sat 01/17/09 06:52 AM
"Actions are held to be good or bad, not on their own merits, but according to who does them. There is almost no kind of outrage, torture, imprisonment without trial, assassination, the bombing of civilians, which does not change its moral color when it is committed by 'our' side. The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them." ~~~ George Orwell

madisonman's photo
Sat 01/17/09 06:49 AM



The UN are a pack of whining hypocrites! Instead of acting preemptively they sit by and let Palestine eat it and piss on Israel time and time again. Palestine had their chance and they blew it AGAIN! They chose Hammas to lead them and now they need to pay for their mistakes! Diplomacy only carries so far and when negotiations break down then you got to bust heads!



How about verifying that. UN has made attempt after attempt to prevent what is happening in Security Council. The efforts were vetoed each and every time!!

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article2000.htm
vetoed by umerika big suprise eh?


no surprise here. time and time again the US has had to veto one-sided obviously biased drivel aimed at making some kind of self serving political statement rather than advancing peace or benefitting mankind.

from UN Watch

http://www.unwatch.org/site/c.bdKKISNqEmG/b.1359197/k.6748/UN_Israel__AntiSemitism.htm

"Demonization of Israel: "Zionism is Racism"

An alien observing the United Nations' debates, reading its resolutions, and walking its halls could well conclude that a principal purpose of the world body is to censure a tiny country called Israel.

Beginning in the late 1960's, the full weight of the UN was gradually but deliberately turned against the country it had conceived by General Assembly resolution a mere two decades earlier. The campaign to demonize and delegitimize Israel in every UN and international forum was initiated by the Arab states together with the Soviet Union, and supported by what has become known as an "automatic majority" of Third World member states."

whoa
one sided what a laugh US/isreal on one side the rest of the free world and not so free world on the otherlaugh

madisonman's photo
Sat 01/17/09 06:30 AM

The UN are a pack of whining hypocrites! Instead of acting preemptively they sit by and let Palestine eat it and piss on Israel time and time again. Palestine had their chance and they blew it AGAIN! They chose Hammas to lead them and now they need to pay for their mistakes! Diplomacy only carries so far and when negotiations break down then you got to bust heads!



How about verifying that. UN has made attempt after attempt to prevent what is happening in Security Council. The efforts were vetoed each and every time!!

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article2000.htm
vetoed by umerika big suprise eh?

madisonman's photo
Sat 01/17/09 06:07 AM



I think we may be in for a round of inflation or devaluation of the dollar that is the fastest way to pay off the massive debt. Ruff times ahead for sure.
I tink it will be a rough ride for all unless your the top 3%...
Oh yea they have their places in Dubia to ride out the economic storm. Thats why the place is booming in construction. tax laws that favor the rich with secrecy laws as well. entire communities built for billionairs

madisonman's photo
Sat 01/17/09 05:58 AM
George Bush bought his "ranch" down in Crawford in 1999 shortly before he started running for president. And now that he's done with politics, he is moving out of there as soon as he possibly can. The Bushes have bought a new home in a tony neighborhood (and until recently a whites-only community) in Dallas. So, what happened to retiring down to the ranch?

Well, it's what most of us suspected - all total bull****. He was never a cowboy. That ranch had nothing on it. No cows, no farming, just a lot of bull**** brush that Bush pretended to clear (for what ****ing purpose?). The ranch was always a political gimmick. It was purchased so that Bush could play the role of the Texas cowboy when in fact he has always been the Andover cheerleader.

So, that pisses me off a little bit. And his brazen abandonment of the ranch as soon as he is out of office just throws it in everyone's face, as if he's saying, "You didn't really believe all that cowboy bull****, did you? You weren't that stupid, were you?"

But what pisses me off a lot more is how the press never told the American people the truth. Now, it might seem like a small thing, in light of all the horrors of the Bush administration and how the press hardly challenged him on any of it. But it is truly indicative, and it did matter when it counted - during the elections.

I don't know why the press feels the need to be so credulous, especially when it comes to Republican candidates. Fred Thompson has this fake red truck he uses whenever he campaigns for office. He instantly puts it away when he's done with that shtick. Why doesn't the press mock him whenever he gets in that stupid red truck that he normally wouldn't be caught dead in? Why did they never challenge Bush on his fake cowboy persona? Why didn't they ask him - hey, what the **** is this ranch for? And isn't it convenient you bought it right before the election?

Why the hell has our press gotten so timid? And when did they think their job became to reinforce the fake images and storylines of politicians rather than to challenge them? It's like they're playing their role in this scripted movie. It's almost as if they're being paid to go along with the fraud. The man grew up in a very exclusive, private boarding school in Connecticut. He was a snotty nosed cheerleader. His grandfather was a United States Senator and his father was the President of the United States of America. He was possibly the most privileged man in America. And the press helped to sell the American people on a line of bull**** about how he was a simple cowboy from a ranch down in Crawford. And it helped to get him elected!

That should be a stain on every reporter who covered him for the rest of their lives.

Young Turks on You Tube
_______

http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/19790

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 09:40 PM

Slowhand...on this board...you're wasting your time...they look at the overwhelming response...as not fair...not balanced...lol...Liberals you see...not realizing that in war...the object is to win...:smile:
The Nazis were great at destroying and killing entire villages for the acts of a few sabatours. I think they actualy called them terrorists by the way.

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 09:36 PM


Rome, 30th May 2008 "The Israeli siege on Gaza continue to punish collectively and illegally civil population, killing them together with their hopes of a dignified life and of a better future: of course rocket launched from Gaza to Sderot are illegal and criminal and must be immediately stopped because they hit Israeli civilians, but the fault of some Palestinian extremists groups cannot be paid as reprisal by one million and a half of non-culpable people.

Today, more examples of collective punishment against Palestinian civilians took place.

Special Israeli Forces raided Khaza'a area, east of Khan Younis, and killed Yosra Qzeih Abu Roq, a 70 years-old woman. Amnesty International in its latest report announced that since the beginning of 2008, "frequent air strikes and other attacks by Israeli forces killed more than 370 Palestinians, including some 50 children, and injured thousands more."
http://www.freegaza.org/pages/media/080530.html
slaphead


The Israelis did not collectively punish the Gazans, the borders had to be tightly controlled to prevent arms smuggling and thwart Hamas attacks. The suffering of the Gazan civilian population was a result of Hamas policies but humanitarian supplies were always let through eventually.

There are endless exaggerated and biased reports against purported abuse of Gazans due to checkpoints, border controls and surveillance. But Israel has never randomly shot rockets into Gaza to target civilians unlike Hamas whose principle military tactic is to try to purposefully harm as many civilians as possible.

Israeli Border controls - inconvenience
Hamas Killing civilians on purpose - war crime

well the UN says otherwise and the only thing that stopped the UN from action was the american veto on the security council. its late for me but a final word once again america is on the wrong side of international law.

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 09:28 PM
I had a 3 month lay off over the summer much like everyone else in the auto industry. Our layoffs are by senority within a job classification. Yougest first on layoff oldest last on layoff. They have to recall you by senority. I was reminded of this when a place in my town just had massive lay offs takeing out who they chose when they chose and mostly they picked off the older workers with more pay and vacation time and they will never return to the jobs they worked many years on. Yes the times are tough but a Union gives you a fair chance at an honest recall. ( I returned to work right b4 thanksgiveing) recalled by senority gurenteed. If you can get a union in your workplace it is well worth the risk of getting canned for doing such. With Obama in office look for a stronger attempt by unions to organize and feel free to contact a union for helping to organize. Lets keep good paying jobs here in america and work together to solve this economic mess created by the republican union busters

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 09:16 PM
Rome, 30th May 2008 "The Israeli siege on Gaza continue to punish collectively and illegally civil population, killing them together with their hopes of a dignified life and of a better future: of course rocket launched from Gaza to Sderot are illegal and criminal and must be immediately stopped because they hit Israeli civilians, but the fault of some Palestinian extremists groups cannot be paid as reprisal by one million and a half of non-culpable people.

Today, more examples of collective punishment against Palestinian civilians took place.

Special Israeli Forces raided Khaza'a area, east of Khan Younis, and killed Yosra Qzeih Abu Roq, a 70 years-old woman. Amnesty International in its latest report announced that since the beginning of 2008, "frequent air strikes and other attacks by Israeli forces killed more than 370 Palestinians, including some 50 children, and injured thousands more."
http://www.freegaza.org/pages/media/080530.html
slaphead

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 08:51 PM


Funny to hear talk of a settlement being considered by the Israelis...umm not...

This wasn't about the poor Israelis being subjected to incoming rockets..it was a well timed offensive at the end of the Bush administrations watch...it was a deliberate effort to kill and maim without consequence.


Looks like the Israelis are preparing to stop their end of it unilaterally. If Hamas also stops then it will be all over. It will be up to Hamas just as it always was.

If there had not been rocket attacks (to the tune of a couple of hundred a day) following Hamas' refusal to maintain the cease fire last fall, then there would never have been any Israeli operation to shut it down. Arguing a conspiracy theory is just weak.

There is a difference between having a religious fanatic neighbor (Hamas) who shoots at your home because they believe that due to your different religion that you defile the neighborhood and the SWAT team (IDF) that comes to arrest them.



How many times are y ou going to repeat this propaganda? the rockets were a feeble responce to an economic blockade of food and medicens and fuel. Jeeze does your google even work?

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 08:34 PM
Dear Friends and Family:

For some years now, I have been saying that the "money changers" and "banksters" in London and New York are setting us up. They're playing a money game in which all of the marbles are on the table. It seems that this game is now in the bottom of the Ninth inning. Tonight I listened to the Reverend Lindsey Williams on American Voice Radio, hosted by Ms. Gianni Hayes. Some people will recognize his name, some won't. I am not going to go into a lengthy bio. You will have to do that research yourself, assuming you even have an interest. I will only mention that he is the man who, because of his contacts in the oil industry, correctly predicted that the world price for oil would fall from roughly $140.00 per barrel to less than $50.00 per barrel. He claims to be well connected to what he calls "the power elite," and I firmly believe that he is telling the truth. But, what he calls the power elite is just one level of corporate America. He interacted with the high paid servants of the oil industry. That would be the executives of ARCO and other big oil companies when he served as chaplain for the Alaska pipeline. He knows and admits that the "real power" is much further up the food chain. Bottom line? Personally, as far as I am concerned, Reverend Williams character and credibility are unimpeachable. I think it is very important to pay attention to what he has to say.

After two hours of interview I had four legal pages of notes. I am going to relate as best I can the highlights of that interview. Some of you will get duplications because some of you are on more than one of my mailing lists. Please understand. I consider this matter to be extremely important!

This will be rough, since it will be stream of consciousness, right off of my note pad. But it is the message that is important and not the delivery.

1. The reason why the "elite" dropped the world price of oil down below $50.00 a barrel was to wage economic warfare against the Arab/ OPEC countries. "They" seek to bankrupt OPEC countries., especially the Iranians by cutting their revenues more than 75%. (Do you think that is why Mr. Chavez is so belligerent towards the USA?) Why would they do that? Because Iran and the other OPEC states are getting too strong and too wealthy. The Iranians are running an oil bourse, that effectively sidesteps the oil markets of New York and London. (My note. Even worse they are trading oil not for dollars but for other currencies such as the Euro. This is a direct threat to the western banking system.) According to Williams, this will not be allowed to continue. This is about control!! "What is happening today has been planned for years and there are other more nefarious motives, which will be outlined below.

2. The world reserve currency is the dollar and dollar denominated assets such as U.S. Treasury Debt. The Arabs have been recycling their petro dollars into U.S. Treasury debt for thirty five years. (My comment. The Arabs/OPEC have been financing our national debt. This is per agreement with the New York Banking establishment, and the U.S. Treasury. This arrangement has been part of the world order since the collapse of the Bretton Wood Agreement in 1971. This is now coming to an end.) Now that they are being bankrupted (intentionally) the OPEC/Arab states are no longer willing or able to buy Treasury Debt. Hence, the interest on the National Debt (which now exceeds 15 Trillion dollars?) is not being financed by foreign creditors. China, India and other Asian states are doing the same thing. "They are running from dollar denominated assets." Therefore, the Federal Reserve is now buying up all the Treasury Debt issued by the U.S. Treasury to cover the debt maintenance on the national debt. (My Comment: this is called monetization and it is highly inflationary.) (My note: to put this in perspective, the so-called bailout, which was really nothing but a heist without the guns, in the amount of 700 billion dollars, was actually in the amount of 8.5 trillion dollars. All of this sum represents more debt "created" by the Federal Reserve which is then added to the National Debt. In addition to being extremely inflationary, we will be paying interest ("tribute?") on this debt to the banksters in perpetuity.)

3. Gold and Oil generally move in tandem i.e., when oil goes up, so does gold. This has not been the case since the oil market collapsed. Gold has shown huge relative strength to the price of oil. Because of intense world wide demand and speculation the relationship between gold and oil will no longer continue. Gold will now move independently of oil.

4. This year, 2009, the USA will face total financial collapse. The dollar will also collapse in value, and it will take years for the U.S.A. to recover.

5. OPEC has been cutting production steadily but they cannot influence the supply of oil enough to affect the world price.

6. Ms. Hayes tried to get pastor Lindsey to point the finger at a particular ethnic group. He would not do so, but much to his credit he said that the Papacy and the Jesuits had nothing to do with what was going on.

7. He said we have more than enough oil in the USA for our own needs, but the so-called "elite" as he calls them have no intention of EVER developing a major oil field in the continental U.S. or Alaska. "They" will not allow this country to become energy independent, and they intend to continue to keep us dependent on foreign oil sources. (My note: Dependency is another world for control.) Later he mentioned the field just disclosed by the USGS which is located in Montana and N. Dakota. (This I believe is the Bakken Field.) He said that it contains 320 billion barrels which is only 10% of the reserves. This oil is worth about 15 trillion dollars. (My note: in others words the 300 BB is the easy oil. It's the oil that will flow out of the ground under its own pressure. That means total reserves of this one field using secondary and tertiary recovery techniques are probably near three trillion barrels. To put that in perspective the Saudis have reserves of about 260 Billion barrels.) One of the senators from Montana has been screaming about this to Congress. He has been totally ignored by both Congress and the media.

8. Regarding Obama. "It did not matter who won the election." The handlers around Obama are, for the most part, members of the Council on Foreign Relations. "The elite." "The globalists." They are essentially the same people who ran the Clinton administration and both Bush Administrations. "There will be absolutely no change in either our domestic or foreign policy. (My note: the people who have looted this country will continue to loot this country.) Regarding economic policies "Obama" will be another Hoover." In other words Obama will follow orders and will take the fall for the economic calamity that is about to unfold. (My note: Obama is another feckless, empty suit, who was selected, trained, groomed, packaged and sold to a gullible, naive and lazy American public.)

9. Because of the tremendous cut in revenue to the Arab states (75%.) Dubai will become a "wasteland." Already they have suspended all construction on major buildings in Dubai. "There will be no change in the future. "

10. All of the Arab states are sliding into a depression. Their budget planning is based upon $80.00 oil, so they are cutting their expenditures dramatically----especially infrastructure and public works.

11. In addition to no longer buying our treasury debt, the Arab/OPEC states are now actively selling what treasury debt they hold. This is also occurring throughout Asia, especially China. This of course amounts to Trillions of dollars of Treasury debt etc. (My Note: if the Fed is now monitizing these debt instruments, which they must surely do since they are the buyer of last resort, this will also be highly inflationary.) The Arabs/OPEC/Asia are converting their dollars and dollar denominated assets to gold and other hard assets.

12. The long term goal of "these people" is to control and own everything. "They intend to break us." (My comment: Geeeez. I am confused. Here, all along, I have been told by the media that our enemies are in the Middle East.)

13. Gasoline will remain at approximately $1.50 per gallon for the next year to a year and half. This is killing the State government gas tax revenues. Total, state tax revenues are collapsing. Expect many states to go bankrupt----especially California.

14. "They" intend to control the world price of oil by dumping massive amounts of oil on the market to keep the price down. They intend to use, among other sources, an oil field in Indonesia that "they" just brought "on line." This field has reserves of more than 300 billion barrels. He also mentioned another field in northern Russia.

15. The ultimate objective is to "destroy the USA." At the same time "they" seek to consolidate control over all assets of any significance. "They" already own and control, the banks, and the media. (My note: Williams did not say, but obviously, they also control the oil industry.) "They" intend to gain control of the entire auto industry. According to Williams "why not buy the auto industry? All they need to do is create the credit in a computer entry." The takeover of the auto industry will happen when the time is right. They also seek control of all the real estate that is worth owning. According to pastor Williams, everyone is going to be paying rent by the time this thing is over. Again he emphasized that "After years of collapse they intend to own everything."

16. Russia is a major world power. Tensions will increase between the west and Russia. Look for a return of the cold war. (My note: he did not say it but I got the feeling that the Russians are not anxious to become part of the New World Order. Of course this oil price suppression is really hurting the Russians. They have had to devalue the Ruble seven times.)

17. "There will be no attack on Iran. There will no war with Iran." "The American people will not stand for it." They intend to accomplish their goal of destroying Iran by economic means. "They will accomplish their goal of destroying Iran without the need of another 911 false flag operation."

18. "Within six to nine months we will be into full blown hyper inflation." "Buy everything you need right NOW!!!!" "Prepare your dinner table NOW! It is going to be 1933 all over again."

19. "The nations of the world, especially China, are dumping U.S. currency and buying gold.

20. "The reason why it is getting so hard for people to buy gold is that "they" do not want people to be able to protect themselves." "They don't want people to have something that is REAL." (My note: it's hard to find any significant quantities of gold anywhere. Silver too!)

21. "They fear people buying gold because it is something "they" can NOT control. They feel that only they, the elite, should own gold.""They regard it as real money."

22. Their greatest fear is that the people will "wake up" from their slumber. "In fact they are terrified." They do not intend to impose martial law. They believe this would cause an armed revolution and that they do not want. Hmmmm. (I guess that is why the founders included the Second Amendment in the Constitution.) "A revolution means they could lose control."

23. "The American people are terrified of Obama." "The day after the election the gun shops in the USA were emptied by alarmed and frightened citizens." "Wal Mart reported that the day after the election their sales of ammunition went up by 400%. It was a record for ammunition sales in a twenty four hour period. (My note: this continued for several weeks after the election.) Evidently this behavior caused a great deal of alarm.

24. "They" have given up on implementing the North American Union and are "going all the way." The goal is total global control of everything. Global Government. Global bank. Global Currency. Etc. (My note: this NWO globalism business has always included a global army, and a global religion. I am sure we will be hearing more about global religion from "Americas pastor," Rick Warren)

Pastor Williams was asked what can we do? He made some suggestion which are not surprising. They are:

1. Get your spiritual house in order. (My note: I totally agree with Rev. Williams. At the core, this struggle is spiritual in nature. It is also a war on human consciousness. And, It is about both controlling and breaking the human spirit. That can only happen if we allow it to happen. "They" need us to surrender our God given powers to them for them to accomplish their evil deeds. Think, think, think! People must learn to use the magnificent brain that God gave us. Be skeptical of everything. In the coming months accept nothing at face value. Investigate everything. To do that you will need to turn off the "electronic sewer" "they" call television. Better yet, throw the damn thing in the dump where it belongs.The electronic and print media are a wasteland designed to keep you distracted, misled, confused and misinformed. You will NEVER discover anything of value watching boobokvision. Never!!!! Trust nobody until that person has EARNED your trust. And above all, question everything, especially if it comes from people in a position of authority. And, finally recognize that "the enemy" is within. The enemies of freedom are right here. Inside the gates.)

2. Plant a garden.

3. Get out of debt. He said debt is the main weapon of subversion and control used by "these people." (My note. I totally agree with that remark unless all of your debt is unsecured and you own no real assets. Can't squeeze blood from a stone.)

4. Store lots of food. "The farm economy is collapsing."

That was all he had to say, but I am sure everyone on this list can fill in the rest.

I would only add, that disclosure is what these parasitic cockroaches fear the most. So, feel free to circulate this memo. But, PLEASE remove my address. I don't want to be spammed. I have already won so many lotteries I just can't collect the money fast enough.

Get ready. Be prepared. Protect yourself and your family. Protect your fellow Americans.
http://www.henrymakow.com/dear_friends_and_family.html

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 04:18 PM





I am glad that there are countries speaking up!!! However, with Turkey being an islamic country it might not do much good. There needs to be more 'christian' countries to speak up about isreal's injust actions.
I agree the west is supposed to be the "good guys" look how far we have sunk when a country like Turky is showeing moral leadership


I have a friend that is an internation student from Turkey. I will be sure to ask him his thoughts about the conflict next time I see him.
I will be interested to know themflowerforyou


If I see him soon and remember to ask him... then I will try to remember to send you an email laugh
rofl

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 04:15 PM



I am glad that there are countries speaking up!!! However, with Turkey being an islamic country it might not do much good. There needs to be more 'christian' countries to speak up about isreal's injust actions.
I agree the west is supposed to be the "good guys" look how far we have sunk when a country like Turky is showeing moral leadership


I have a friend that is an internation student from Turkey. I will be sure to ask him his thoughts about the conflict next time I see him.
I will be interested to know themflowerforyou

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 04:05 PM

I am glad that there are countries speaking up!!! However, with Turkey being an islamic country it might not do much good. There needs to be more 'christian' countries to speak up about isreal's injust actions.
I agree the west is supposed to be the "good guys" look how far we have sunk when a country like Turky is showeing moral leadership

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 03:58 PM
Turkey's Prime Minister has called for Israel to be barred from the UN as long as it ignores international calls to stop war on Gaza.

"How is such a country, which does not implement resolutions of the UN Security Council, allowed to enter through the gates of the UN (headquarters)?" Recep Tayyip Erdogan inquired on Friday.

The remarks came before UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon's arrival in Ankara to discuss the conflict and amid growing outrage in Turkey over Israel's attacks on Gaza.

Erdogan lashed out at the Israeli army's raids on civilians under the pretext of targeting the Palestinian fighters in the territory. He also accused the Israeli media of falsely suggesting that Hamas uses civilians as human shields in the Gaza Strip.

The UN chief, who traveled to the West Bank on Thursday, has urged an end to the 'unbearable' situation in Gaza and called on Israel for a unilateral humanitarian truce.

Last Thursday, the UN Security Council approved a resolution which demanded an "immediate" and "durable" ceasefire leading to the "full withdrawal" of Israeli forces from Gaza. It also called for "the unimpeded provision and distribution throughout Gaza of humanitarian assistance, including of food, fuel and medical treatment."

Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, however, vowed to resist outside pressure and push ahead with the military action against Gaza, while Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni said Israel would act 'only according to its interests'.

Weeks of ceaseless Israeli airstrikes and tank shelling have so far killed more than 1,133 Palestinians across the impoverished coastal sliver, which has been under Israel's crippling blockade since June 2007.

On Friday, Turkish President Abdullah Gul renewed calls for an immediate cease-fire and urged US President-elect Barack Obama to focus on a comprehensive, long-lasting and fair solution to the issue once he is in office.
http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=82565&sectionid=351020202

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 03:39 PM


I think we may be in for a round of inflation or devaluation of the dollar that is the fastest way to pay off the massive debt. Ruff times ahead for sure.
I tink it will be a rough ride for all unless your the top 3%...
Oh yea they have there places in Dubia to ride out the economic storm. Thats why the place is booming in construction. tax laws that favor the rich with secrecy laws as well. entire communities built for billionairs

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 03:28 PM
I think we may be in for a round of inflation or devaluation of the dollar that is the fastest way to pay off the massive debt. Ruff times ahead for sure.

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 03:21 PM

These bailouts scare me. Devaluing the dollar more and will not create growth. I think they should have really looked at the Auto Industry and perhaps retooled it for the 21st century. No matter how you look at it oil is outdated and a very limited supply. Maybe Pickens plan on retooling the trucks to natural gas and when the infrastructure was able to accept it do the same with the cars, The infrastructure wouldn't take much as most places have natural gas for heating and cooking. You could put mobile refuelers out till it does. A stepping stone off of oil and a cushion till we come up with better technology....Just MO
thats all well and good but the bankers had no hoops to jump or even say were the money would go or to who they just got handed a blank check.

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 03:16 PM
by Paul Krugman

Last Sunday President-elect Barack Obama was asked whether he would seek an investigation of possible crimes by the Bush administration. "I don't believe that anybody is above the law," he responded, but "we need to look forward as opposed to looking backwards."
I'm sorry, but if we don't have an inquest into what happened during the Bush years - and nearly everyone has taken Mr. Obama's remarks to mean that we won't - this means that those who hold power are indeed above the law because they don't face any consequences if they abuse their power.

Let's be clear what we're talking about here. It's not just torture and illegal wiretapping, whose perpetrators claim, however implausibly, that they were patriots acting to defend the nation's security. The fact is that the Bush administration's abuses extended from environmental policy to voting rights. And most of the abuses involved using the power of government to reward political friends and punish political enemies.

At the Justice Department, for example, political appointees illegally reserved nonpolitical positions for "right-thinking Americans" - their term, not mine - and there's strong evidence that officials used their positions both to undermine the protection of minority voting rights and to persecute Democratic politicians.

The hiring process at Justice echoed the hiring process during the occupation of Iraq - an occupation whose success was supposedly essential to national security - in which applicants were judged by their politics, their personal loyalty to President Bush and, according to some reports, by their views on Roe v. Wade, rather than by their ability to do the job.

Speaking of Iraq, let's also not forget that country's failed reconstruction: the Bush administration handed billions of dollars in no-bid contracts to politically connected companies, companies that then failed to deliver. And why should they have bothered to do their jobs? Any government official who tried to enforce accountability on, say, Halliburton quickly found his or her career derailed.

There's much, much more. By my count, at least six important government agencies experienced major scandals over the past eight years - in most cases, scandals that were never properly investigated. And then there was the biggest scandal of all: Does anyone seriously doubt that the Bush administration deliberately misled the nation into invading Iraq?

Why, then, shouldn't we have an official inquiry into abuses during the Bush years?

One answer you hear is that pursuing the truth would be divisive, that it would exacerbate partisanship. But if partisanship is so terrible, shouldn't there be some penalty for the Bush administration's politicization of every aspect of government?

Alternatively, we're told that we don't have to dwell on past abuses, because we won't repeat them. But no important figure in the Bush administration, or among that administration's political allies, has expressed remorse for breaking the law. What makes anyone think that they or their political heirs won't do it all over again, given the chance?

In fact, we've already seen this movie. During the Reagan years, the Iran-contra conspirators violated the Constitution in the name of national security. But the first President Bush pardoned the major malefactors, and when the White House finally changed hands the political and media establishment gave Bill Clinton the same advice it's giving Mr. Obama: let sleeping scandals lie. Sure enough, the second Bush administration picked up right where the Iran-contra conspirators left off - which isn't too surprising when you bear in mind that Mr. Bush actually hired some of those conspirators.

Now, it's true that a serious investigation of Bush-era abuses would make Washington an uncomfortable place, both for those who abused power and those who acted as their enablers or apologists. And these people have a lot of friends. But the price of protecting their comfort would be high: If we whitewash the abuses of the past eight years, we'll guarantee that they will happen again.

Meanwhile, about Mr. Obama: while it's probably in his short-term political interests to forgive and forget, next week he's going to swear to "preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States." That's not a conditional oath to be honored only when it's convenient.

And to protect and defend the Constitution, a president must do more than obey the Constitution himself; he must hold those who violate the Constitution accountable. So Mr. Obama should reconsider his apparent decision to let the previous administration get away with crime. Consequences aside, that's not a decision he has the right to make.

© 2009 The New York Times
Paul Krugman is professor of Economics and International Affairs at Princeton University and a regular columnist for The New York Times. On October 13, 2008, it was announced that Mr. Krugman would receive the Nobel Prize in Economics. He is the author of numerous books, including The Conscience of A Liberal, and his most recent, The Return of Depression Economics.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/01/16-5

madisonman's photo
Fri 01/16/09 03:11 PM
Edited by madisonman on Fri 01/16/09 03:11 PM
Voting "yes" were 40 Democrats, 10 Republicans and 2 independents.

Voting "no" were 4 Democrats and 31 Republicans.

Looks like we can thank four dems for voteing against the bailout and 31 republicans for voteing it down. Thanks to Bush in this case america was saved t hough he had a great hand in wrecking it in the first place.

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