This thread seeks to discuss what sorts of things can be true. Now, I want to say here that I'm not talking about every common use of the term "true". Rather I'm talking about being true in the sense of corresponding to and/or agreeing with fact; reality; the way things are.

I propose the candidate of beliefs, which entails statements thereof. It seems to me that belief and the statements thereof are true or not.

So, if this is accepted, then what makes a statement true/false? If it is not accepted, then put forth a counterargument.



Hopefully this thread will do something. Although, it seems that those who are philosophically inclined do not venture into here much anymore...

.. what's true.. this is a suck topic..
.. what makes it true.. this is a suck topic..

Well, I can't say that I'd disagree with the 'formulation', but the conclusion, I do.

So, reformulated we would have something like...

'This is a suck topic' is true if, and only if, this is a suck topic.

Yeah, I'd go with that formulation.

.. so we're . in agreement then. that this is a . suck topic..lol..ps.. so you could say the truth of the matter is.. this is a suck topic..lol

Not at all. Our agreement(I assume) is what it would take for that particular statement to be true, not that it is so.

You do understand the difference, right?

Oh, now you've gone and shown that you don't understand what truth us nor how it works. And I was so hopeful.

What does "the truth of the matter" mean?

I mean... define truth as it is used in that phrase.

Yeah, I dunno.

It's rather curious to me that some folk seem to have no interest in what makes things true, or in what sorts of things can be so. I mean, these sorts of things pervade our everyday lives on a very real level. We all assume that what we believe is true. We take these things for granted... constantly. The consequences of not knowing what it is that makes belief true could be quite severe, for if one does not know that much, how could they be possibly expected to be able to tell the difference between what's true and what's not.

This lack in awareness is apparent if one just looks at what American society has accepted with regard to politics, and the like. Ah, but I digress...

I personally think that knowing these sorts of things to the best of our ability is crucial to having a good grasp on the way things are.

I suppose some folk don't see it that way...

. gremlins..

. your perception of the truth.. doesn't necessarily mean. that it holds water for me... and you're making assumptions.. are assuming.. and you know what they say.. when you assume..lol

Alright, since it seems my interlocutor has abandoned the conversation, his statement deserves some attention.

"This is a suck topic" <----there it is.

Ok. First, we need to ask ourselves if this is the sort of thing that can be true? Well, it is a statement of belief; however, it is one which is not truth-apt in the same way that "The sun is hot" is. What I mean by that is that the statement in question is a statement of personal preference. The problem is that what is implicit in the claim need be made explicit so that we can properly assess it.

A topic is not the sort of thing that can "suck" in the same way that it can be... say, about tigers. The difference here is key. The former is about personal preferences, whereas the latter is about matters of fact. The speaker evidently doesn't find the topic interesting nor worthy of discussion, which is fine of course, because it need not be found interesting by everyone in order to be interesting to some and useful to all.

So, if we make the implicit explicit we would arrive at something like this...

"I think that this topic sucks."

Now, if it is the case that the speaker believe his own words then the statement above would be true.

.. sure it can.. and my truth is.. that it. sucks..lol.. I want to see how long you can keep talking to yourself..lmao..

Yeah yeah... and your grammar is horrible. So what?

Care to engage the topic itself or the following question about your own claims?

How does one 'perceive the truth'? I mean, what on earth is that supposed to mean? I can perceive things by virtue of sensory perception; however, truth is most certainly not perceived in the same way. We don't touch it, or hear it, or taste it, or...

The assumption argument is vacuous. We all assume all sorts of stuff all the time, regardless of whether or not we know and/or admit it. You'll have to do better than that.

.. is A Ice Cube not cold..ps. yeah yeah. leave my grandmother out of it..lol

Well there it is! I knew something funny was going on. You've confused your own belief and personal preference with truth. Belief is insufficient for truth.

There is no such thing as my truth, your truth, his truth, or her truth. It is much better understood for what it is by using more appropriate terms...

Not "your truth", but rather your belief. That is... that which you believe to be true.

.. this topic sucks. I believe that to be true..

Yeah, yeah, yeah... I know.

Far be it for me to attempt to convince you of the importance of knowing what sorts of things can be true and what makes them so, when it seems all you're concerned with is attempting to bash an otherwise quite relevant topic in conventional academic discourse.

You don't have to like it. The problem is that the subject matter itself underpins every thought and belief that runs through your mind. If you believe that sucks, then so be it.

You don't have to stay.

.. okay I'll leave you alone with your topic. and your thoughts.. true or otherwise..lol. I'm just playing with you dude.. there how's that for truth....

No worries. I'm rather thick-skinned.



With regard to your last statement, if by "truth" you mean... "How's that for a true statement?", then I would say...

If it is the case that you're just joking around, then it would be a true one.

.. I know creativesoul..
. I have kids to put to bed.. dishes to do.. laundry to fold.. welcome to my truth..lol.. talk to you later.. R type to you later..lol