Previous 1 3 4 5
Topic: Jesus Can't Be the Messiah
teadipper's photo
Thu 06/20/13 10:48 PM
Please prove me wrong:

http://www.aish.com/jw/s/48892792.html


Why Jews Don't Believe In Jesus
For 2,000 years Jews have rejected the Christian idea of Jesus as messiah. Why?
by Rabbi Shraga Simmons

with thanks to Rabbi Michael Skobac, Jews for Judaism

One of the most common questions we receive at Aish.com is: "Why don't Jews believe in Jesus?" Let's understand why ― not in order to disparage other religions, but rather to clarify the Jewish position.

Jews do not accept Jesus as the messiah because:

Jesus did not fulfill the messianic prophecies.
Jesus did not embody the personal qualifications of the Messiah.
Biblical verses "referring" to Jesus are mistranslations.
Jewish belief is based on national revelation.

But first, some background: What exactly is the Messiah?

The word "Messiah" is an English rendering of the Hebrew word Mashiach, which means "anointed." It usually refers to a person initiated into God's service by being anointed with oil. (Exodus 29:7, 1-Kings 1:39, 2-Kings 9:3)

1. Jesus Did Not Fulfill the Messianic Prophecies

What is the Messiah supposed to accomplish? One of the central themes of biblical prophecy is the promise of a future age of perfection characterized by universal peace and recognition of God. (Isaiah 2:1-4, 32:15-18, 60:15-18; Zephaniah 3:9; Hosea 2:20-22; Amos 9:13-15; Micah 4:1-4; Zechariah 8:23, 14:9; Jeremiah 31:33-34)

Specifically, the Bible says he will:

Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).
Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).
Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)
Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel, which will unite humanity as one. As it says: "God will be King over all the world ― on that day, God will be One and His Name will be One" (Zechariah 14:9).

If an individual fails to fulfill even one of these conditions, then he cannot be the Messiah.

Because no one has ever fulfilled the Bible's description of this future King, Jews still await the coming of the Messiah. All past Messianic claimants, including Jesus of Nazareth, Bar Cochba and Shabbtai Tzvi have been rejected.

Christians counter that Jesus will fulfill these in the Second Coming. Jewish sources show that the Messiah will fulfill the prophecies outright; in the Bible no concept of a second coming exists.

____________________

2) Jesus Did Not Embody the Personal Qualifications of Messiah

A. Messiah as Prophet

The Messiah will become the greatest prophet in history, second only to Moses. (Targum - Isaiah 11:2; Maimonides - Yad Teshuva 9:2)

Prophecy can only exist in Israel when the land is inhabited by a majority of world Jewry, a situation which has not existed since 300 BCE. During the time of Ezra, when the majority of Jews remained in Babylon, prophecy ended upon the death of the last prophets ― Haggai, Zechariah and Malachi.

Jesus appeared on the scene approximately 350 years after prophecy had ended, and thus could not be a prophet.

B. Descendent of David

Many prophetic passages speak of a descendant of King David who will rule Israel during the age of perfection. (Isaiah 11:1-9; Jeremiah 23:5-6, 30:7-10, 33:14-16; Ezekiel 34:11-31, 37:21-28; Hosea 3:4-5)

The Messiah must be descended on his father's side from King David (see Genesis 49:10, Isaiah 11:1, Jeremiah 23:5, 33:17; Ezekiel 34:23-24). According to the Christian claim that Jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father ― and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father's side from King David. (1)

According to Jewish sources, the Messiah will be born of human parents and possess normal physical attributes like other people. He will not be a demi-god, (2) nor will he possess supernatural qualities.

C. Torah Observance

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"

____________________

3) Mistranslated Verses "Referring" to Jesus

Biblical verses can only be understood by studying the original Hebrew text ― which reveals many discrepancies in the Christian translation.

A. Virgin Birth

The Christian idea of a virgin birth is derived from the verse in Isaiah 7:14 describing an "alma" as giving birth. The word "alma" has always meant a young woman, but Christian theologians came centuries later and translated it as "virgin." This accords Jesus' birth with the first century pagan idea of mortals being impregnated by gods.

B. Suffering Servant

Christianity claims that Isaiah chapter 53 refers to Jesus, as the "suffering servant."

In actuality, Isaiah 53 directly follows the theme of chapter 52, describing the exile and redemption of the Jewish people. The prophecies are written in the singular form because the Jews ("Israel") are regarded as one unit. Throughout Jewish scripture, Israel is repeatedly called, in the singular, the "Servant of God" (see Isaiah 43:8). In fact, Isaiah states no less than 11 times in the chapters prior to 53 that the Servant of God is Israel.

When read correctly, Isaiah 53 clearly [and ironically] refers to the Jewish people being "bruised, crushed and as sheep brought to slaughter" at the hands of the nations of the world. These descriptions are used throughout Jewish scripture to graphically describe the suffering of the Jewish people (see Psalm 44).

Isaiah 53 concludes that when the Jewish people are redeemed, the nations will recognize and accept responsibility for the inordinate suffering and death of the Jews.

______________________

4) Jewish Belief is Based Solely on National Revelation

Throughout history, thousands of religions have been started by individuals, attempting to convince people that he or she is God's true prophet. But personal revelation is an extremely weak basis for a religion because one can never know if it is indeed true. Since others did not hear God speak to this person, they have to take his word for it. Even if the individual claiming personal revelation performs miracles, they do not prove he is a genuine prophet. All the miracles show ― assuming they are genuine ― is that he has certain powers. It has nothing to do with his claim of prophecy.

Judaism, unique among all of the world's major religions, does not rely on "claims of miracles" as the basis for its religion. In fact, the Bible says that God sometimes grants the power of "miracles" to charlatans, in order to test Jewish loyalty to the Torah (Deut. 13:4).

Of the thousands of religions in human history, only Judaism bases its belief on national revelation ― i.e. God speaking to the entire nation. If God is going to start a religion, it makes sense He'll tell everyone, not just one person.

Maimonides states (Foundations of Torah, ch. 8):

The Jews did not believe in Moses, our teacher, because of the miracles he performed. Whenever anyone's belief is based on seeing miracles, he has lingering doubts, because it is possible the miracles were performed through magic or sorcery. All of the miracles performed by Moses in the desert were because they were necessary, and not as proof of his prophecy.

What then was the basis of [Jewish] belief? The Revelation at Mount Sinai, which we saw with our own eyes and heard with our own ears, not dependent on the testimony of others... as it says, "Face to face, God spoke with you..." The Torah also states: "God did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us ― who are all here alive today." (Deut. 5:3)

Judaism is not miracles. It is the personal eyewitness experience of every man, woman and child, standing at Mount Sinai 3,300 years ago.

For further reading: "Did God Speak at Mount Sinai?"

Waiting for the Messiah

The world is in desperate need of Messianic redemption. To the extent that we are aware of the problems of society, is the extent we will yearn for redemption. As the Talmud says, one of the first questions asked of a Jew on Judgment Day is: "Did you yearn for the arrival of the Messiah?"

How can we hasten the coming of the Messiah? The best way is to love all humanity generously, to keep the mitzvot of the Torah (as best we can), and to encourage others to do so as well.

Despite the gloom, the world does seem headed toward redemption. One apparent sign is that the Jewish people have returned to the Land of Israel and made it bloom again. Additionally, a major movement is afoot of young Jews returning to Torah tradition.

The Messiah can come any day, and it all depends on our actions. God is ready when we are. For as King David says: "Redemption will come today ― if you hearken to His voice."

For further study: • Jews for Judaism

• "The Real Messiah," by Rabbi Aryeh Kaplan

• "Let's Get Biblical! Why Doesn't Judaism Accept the Christian Messiah?," by Rabbi Tovia Singer

• "The Path of the Righteous Gentile," by Chaim Clorfene and Yakov Rogalsky

FOOTNOTES

Click here to receive Aish.com's free weekly email.

(1) In response, it is claimed that Joseph adopted Jesus, and passed on his genealogy via adoption. There are two problems with this claim:

a) There is no biblical basis for the idea of a father passing on his tribal line by adoption. A priest who adopts a son from another tribe cannot make him a priest by adoption.

b) Joseph could never pass on by adoption that which he doesn't have. Because Joseph descended from Jeconiah (Matthew 1:11) he fell under the curse of that king that none of his descendants could ever sit as king upon the throne of David. (Jeremiah 22:30; 36:30)

To answer this difficult problem, apologists claim that Jesus traces himself back to King David through his mother Mary, who allegedly descends from David, as shown in the third chapter of Luke. There are four basic problems with this claim:

a) There is no evidence that Mary descends from David. The third chapter of Luke traces Joseph's genealogy, not Mary's.

b) Even if Mary can trace herself back to David, that doesn't help Jesus, since tribal affiliation goes only through the father, not mother. Cf. Numbers 1:18; Ezra 2:59.

c) Even if family line could go through the mother, Mary was not from a legitimate Messianic family. According to the Bible, the Messiah must be a descendent of David through his son Solomon (II Samuel 7:14; I Chronicles 17:11-14, 22:9-10, 28:4-6). The third chapter of Luke is irrelevant to this discussion because it describes lineage of David's son Nathan, not Solomon. (Luke 3:31)

d) Luke 3:27 lists Shealtiel and Zerubbabel in his genealogy. These two also appear in Matthew 1:12 as descendants of the cursed Jeconiah. If Mary descends from them, it would also disqualify her from being a Messianic progenitor.

(2) Maimonides devotes much of the "Guide for the Perplexed" to the fundamental idea that God is incorporeal, meaning that He assumes no physical form. God is Eternal, above time. He is Infinite, beyond space. He cannot be born, and cannot die. Saying that God assumes human form makes God small, diminishing both His unity and His divinity. As the Torah says: "God is not a mortal" (Numbers 23:19)
Give Tzedakah! Help Aish.com create inspiring
articles, videos and blogs featuring timeless Jewish wisdom.

Published: March 6, 2004
Visitor Comments: 299

(266) Michelle, June 17, 2013 4:07 AM

Thanks

Thanks for the clarification on the importance of national revelation. I'm not Jewish but this made sense.

(265) Anonymous, June 5, 2013 4:15 PM

additional points re moshiach

Dear Rabbi Simmons,
I occasionall have discussions with very knowledgable Christians who seem to be honestly seeking truth. I state what Israels Moshiach will accomplish, as you lead your article with, as pre-requesets to knowing who he is. Please clarify two other points that come up in these discussions: the concept of Moshiach ben Dovid and Moshiach ben Yosef (re:second coming) and Gen.6:6 reference to nephilim, fallen angles who cohabited with women and produced the giants. Also there are the angles (spritual beings) who took human form with Avraham Avinu and Simshon's parents.(re:"virgin" birth)

(264) Maxwell, June 5, 2013 7:30 AM

Eye opener

Thanks for this spiritually educative article. As a Christian from birth, as i grew up, i began to question many Christian doctrines especially the one that uphold Jesus Christ as God. I don't believe that God would allow him be tempted and finally killed his creation. Christ never made this claim. I have been longing for true worship of God and thats why i stopped going to church to this day. Thanks for this eye opener.

(263) Denis MacEoin, May 13, 2013 4:04 PM

Jesus was a Jew

I have always understood that Jesus was, first and foremost, a Jew. Far from his being non-observant, he made it clear he had not come to bypass the law and the prophets. After his death, the first Christian church was based in Jerusalem under his brother James, and all its members were observant Jews. They only dispersed after AD 70. It was Paul who introduced all the nonsense about Jesus being God, one third of a Trinity, being resurrected and so on. Understood properly, Jesus plays an important role in 2nd-temple Judaism, while the larger role is based on a fiction that became Christianity.

(262) Yehoshua Shiloni, April 18, 2013 6:38 PM


no photo
Thu 06/20/13 11:03 PM
Very interesting.

no photo
Thu 06/20/13 11:13 PM
not undersand sorry

Dodo_David's photo
Fri 06/21/13 08:02 AM
I will quote a written statement produced by the rabbis of the Shema Yisrael synagogue in Detroit.

The prophecies in the Hebrew Scriptures assure us that Yeshua is the Messiah. God wanted us to be able to recognize the Messiah when He came:

? The Messiah had to be born in Bethlehem (Micah 5:1-2). See Matthew 2:1-6, Luke 2:1-20.

? The Messiah would be more than a man. He would be God in human form (Isaiah 9:6-7, Jeremiah 23:5-6, Psalm 110:1, Proverbs 30:4). See John 1:1, 20:28; Hebrews 1:8.

? The Messiah had to come before Jerusalem was destroyed in 70 AD (Daniel 9:24-27). See Luke 1:5, 2:1-7.

? The Messiah had to be a direct descendant of King David, a member of the royal family of Israel (Jeremiah 23:5-6, Isaiah 9:6-7). See Matthew 1.

? The Messiah was to be tried and unfairly condemned, even though He was perfectly innocent (Isaiah 53:8). See Matthew 27:1-2, Luke 23:1-25.

? The Messiah would die to make atonement for the sin of Israel and the world (Isaiah 53:5-6, 8, 10-12; Daniel 9:24-27; Zechariah 9:9, 12:10; Psalm 16:10, 22). See John 1:29, 11:49-52; 1 Corinthians 15:53.

? The Messiah was to be a light to the nations, so that God’s salvation could reach to the ends of the Earth (Isaiah 49:6). Yeshua is the most popular, the most studied and the most influential figure in the history of mankind. He is the most famous Jew who ever lived: more famous than Abraham, more famous than Moses, more famous than King David or any of the prophets, more famous than Freud or Einstein! If people throughout the world know about Israel, or pray to the God of Israel, or read the Holy Scriptures of Israel, it is because of Yeshua. No Jewish person should be indifferent to the fact that this Jewish man has had such a tremendous part in the history of mankind. The love He has inspired, the comfort He has given, the good He has engendered, the hope and joy He has kindled are unequaled in human history. He truly has become the light of the world!

? The Messiah would rise from the dead (Isaiah 53:8-12; Psalm 16:10, 118:21-24; Zechariah 12:10). The New Testament records that after His death and resurrection, Yeshua appeared to a wide variety of Jewish people in varying numbers and under varying circumstances. He appeared to Mary (John 20:11-18); to some other women (Matthew 28:8-10); to Simon Peter (Luke 24:34); to two on the road to Emmaus (Luke 24:13-35); to 10 of the apostles (Luke 24:36-43); to all 11 apostles eight days later (John 20:24-29); then to seven by the Kinneret (the Sea of Galilee – see John 21:1-23). Yeshua appeared to 500 people at once, most of whom were alive and could verify the event when the New Testament was written (1 Cor. 15:6)! Yeshua appeared to His brother James, who became the leader of the Jerusalem Congregation (1 Corinthians 15:7), and to Rabbi Paul of Tarsus, who became better known as the Apostle Paul (Acts 9:1-16). Since the first century there have been millions of people, both Jews and Gentiles (including some of the greatest thinkers, philosophers and scientists), who have claimed to have encountered the resurrected Yeshua. What transformed all of these people? Only one explanation makes sense – He is alive today!

Yeshua’s resurrection makes Him absolutely unique in the history of the world and puts him on a level far higher than any of the prophets of Israel or any other religion or any philosopher. Buddha is still in his tomb. Mohammed is still in his grave. Confucius is still dead. Marx, Lenin and Freud are still in their graves. Only Yeshua has been raised from death! Since God would never allow a liar, a deceiver, or a false Messiah to be resurrected, Yeshua’s resurrection validates His person, His ministry and His message. His resurrection is God’s seal of approval on everything that Yeshua did and taught, and God’s declaration to the world that Yeshua is Messiah and Savior of mankind. Therefore, we ought to pay attention to every word He uttered, since He spoke the truth without any error.

History tells us that only one man – Yeshua of Nazareth – fulfilled these prophecies and many others. No other man in history even comes close. The probability that one person could fulfill all these prophecies by chance is infinitesimally small. There is only one rational conclusion: Yeshua is the Messiah of Israel whom the prophets told us to expect.


The Union of Messianic Jewish Congregations and the Messianic Jewish Alliance of America explain why they believe that Y'shua is the Messiah.

The organization Jews for Jesus has an essay in which the organization explains why Y'shua is the Messiah. The essay begins with the following statement:

It is important to begin by saying that for one who has already made up his or her mind that Jesus is not the Messiah, no amount of evidence will be convincing. But for those who are honest in asking, the evidence speaks for itself.

RKISIT's photo
Fri 06/21/13 08:20 AM
Posting a traditional jewish page and posting a messianic jews page is like having 2 experts testifying in court.They are both experts in a certain field yet they both have different conclusions.
Do i accept jesus as the messiah?No.I do think maybe he may have existed but he wasn't the exaggerated demigod in the new testament.

Milesoftheusa's photo
Fri 06/21/13 11:07 AM
Just a little tidbit.

The jews use Yeshua because The Name of Yahweh is to Holy to be pronounced.. Same reasoning the Christians took when changing YHWH to LORD.

They us the Talmud.. This was the Handwriting that was against us when Yahshua came and spoke of.

The Talmud is a Rabbi's interpretation like a Christians commentary.

Both hold to the name of Yahweh is to Holy and to be only spoken by the High Priests. How do I know a lot of this? From my dealings speaking with Levi Cohen who I am not sure if he is still alive or not.. But in the Early 2000's he was so well known worldwide that on the Jewish ( biblical) High Sabbaths like The Feast of Tabernacles Or Day of Atonement he was flown to Jerusalem from Chicago to give the Blessings for Israel at the Wailing wall. He taught me a lot and he knew all about Yahshua.. and he never said what I was asking him was wrong.. he would shake or nod his head this is how he would answer a question he knew would get him in trouble.

When Yahshua showed up on the scene when their was a question the Rabbi's did not go to the Torah for answers they go to the Talmud which a Rabbi wrote. Yahshua being the word they made the Talmud the word thus making their Rabbi a Messiah already before Yahshua came.

Take when they accussed him about pulling an ox out of a ditch on the Sabbath? How did Yahshua answer them?

What we are not taught is if a ox fell in a ditch whether on the Sabbath or not would mean it was not protected for any animal or human to fall in as the Torah demands. No different than say barriers around road construction to protect us.

So if lets say the state did not put up barriers and you fell in a ditch they made, who's fault would it be? asking this question was a Talmudic belief from the Talmud not the Torah. So when Yahshua said why? it had way more to do with than the Sabbath, The sabbath was used to try and trick him. The NT speaks of them trying to trick him over and over. This question had nothing to do on the Sabbath because on the Sabbath you are to do good. and whether a persons life or an animals life u were in charge of u were to protect. So the real culprit in these verses was why wasn't the Ditch protected? that's the Torahs rule. So the Rabbi did not care about the Sabbath but to bring the man who threatened their rule down.

THE HANDWRITING that was against us. Not the Torah as so many believe.

Another question they do not answer is Moshe's prophesy of " a prophet will rise up like unto me him u r to listen to"

The jews claim Yahshua or as they say Yeshua as a prophet don't let anyone say any different so does Islam. Just not the messiah.

Want some basic proof of Moshe's Prophet we are to listen to?

It's easy who does most of the world listen to? that's your answer as simple as can be from Their own greatest Prophet Moshe. It's Yahshua of Nazereth

Milesoftheusa's photo
Fri 06/21/13 11:40 AM

Just a little tidbit.

The jews use Yeshua because The Name of Yahweh is to Holy to be pronounced.. Same reasoning the Christians took when changing YHWH to LORD.

They us the Talmud.. This was the Handwriting that was against us when Yahshua came and spoke of.

The Talmud is a Rabbi's interpretation like a Christians commentary.

Both hold to the name of Yahweh is to Holy and to be only spoken by the High Priests. How do I know a lot of this? From my dealings speaking with Levi Cohen who I am not sure if he is still alive or not.. But in the Early 2000's he was so well known worldwide that on the Jewish ( biblical) High Sabbaths like The Feast of Tabernacles Or Day of Atonement he was flown to Jerusalem from Chicago to give the Blessings for Israel at the Wailing wall. He taught me a lot and he knew all about Yahshua.. and he never said what I was asking him was wrong.. he would shake or nod his head this is how he would answer a question he knew would get him in trouble.

When Yahshua showed up on the scene when their was a question the Rabbi's did not go to the Torah for answers they go to the Talmud which a Rabbi wrote. Yahshua being the word they made the Talmud the word thus making their Rabbi a Messiah already before Yahshua came.

Take when they accussed him about pulling an ox out of a ditch on the Sabbath? How did Yahshua answer them?

What we are not taught is if a ox fell in a ditch whether on the Sabbath or not would mean it was not protected for any animal or human to fall in as the Torah demands. No different than say barriers around road construction to protect us.

So if lets say the state did not put up barriers and you fell in a ditch they made, who's fault would it be? asking this question was a Talmudic belief from the Talmud not the Torah. So when Yahshua said why? it had way more to do with than the Sabbath, The sabbath was used to try and trick him. The NT speaks of them trying to trick him over and over. This question had nothing to do on the Sabbath because on the Sabbath you are to do good. and whether a persons life or an animals life u were in charge of u were to protect. So the real culprit in these verses was why wasn't the Ditch protected? that's the Torahs rule. So the Rabbi did not care about the Sabbath but to bring the man who threatened their rule down.

THE HANDWRITING that was against us. Not the Torah as so many believe.

Another question they do not answer is Moshe's prophesy of " a prophet will rise up like unto me him u r to listen to"

The jews claim Yahshua or as they say Yeshua as a prophet don't let anyone say any different so does Islam. Just not the messiah.

Want some basic proof of Moshe's Prophet we are to listen to?

It's easy who does most of the world listen to? that's your answer as simple as can be from Their own greatest Prophet Moshe. It's Yahshua of Nazereth


Another thing u should consider which a lot of people will not like.

Three major events happen in the scriptures which happen before the most important people in Biblical history starts.

The slaughter of the Innocents.

1 Moshe was put in a river so that he would not be killed. as children were being slaughtered.

2 Yahshua was taken to Eygpt to avoid the Slaughter of the Innocent. A prophet like unto Moshe being raised up.

3 The 3rd that has been happening since Roe vs Wade. another Slaughter of the Innocents before Yahshua's return.. Think about it.

Milesoftheusa's photo
Fri 06/21/13 12:35 PM

C. Torah Observance

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"


Go ask a Rabbi if this article is true why they would let a False Prophet have...?







Jesus was a Jew

I have always understood that Jesus was, first and foremost, a Jew. Far from his being non-observant, he made it clear he had not come to bypass the law and the prophets. After his death, the first Christian church was based in Jerusalem under his brother James, and all its members were observant Jews. They only dispersed after AD 70. It was Paul who introduced all the nonsense about Jesus being God, one third of a Trinity, being resurrected and so on. Understood properly, Jesus plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism, while the larger role is based on a fiction that became Christianity.


Now why would the Jews allow a FALSE PROHET who is to be stoned a.. "plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism"

Which is he a False Prophet or a Prophet?

another thing anyone who has ever dealt with Jews how many times have you seen them write God as G-D?

Ask this person why Observant jews do this yet he does not? Ask him why they use G-d?

I think we found our false Prophet!!!!





Toodygirl5's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:00 PM

I will quote a written statement produced by the rabbis of the Shema Yisrael synagogue in Detroit.

The prophecies in the Hebrew Scriptures assure us that Yeshua is the Messiah. God wanted us to be able to recognize the Messiah when He came:

? The Messiah had to be born in Bethlehem (Micah 5:1-2). See Matthew 2:1-6, Luke 2:1-20.

? The Messiah would be more than a man. He would be God in human form (Isaiah 9:6-7, Jeremiah 23:5-6, Psalm 110:1, Proverbs 30:4). See John 1:1, 20:28; Hebrews 1:8.

? The Messiah had to come before Jerusalem was destroyed in 70 AD (Daniel 9:24-27). See Luke 1:5, 2:1-7.

? The Messiah had to be a direct descendant of King David, a member of the royal family of Israel (Jeremiah 23:5-6, Isaiah 9:6-7). See Matthew 1.

? The Messiah was to be tried and unfairly condemned, even though He was perfectly innocent (Isaiah 53:8). See Matthew 27:1-2, Luke 23:1-25.

? The Messiah would die to make atonement for the sin of Israel and the world (Isaiah 53:5-6, 8, 10-12; Daniel 9:24-27; Zechariah 9:9, 12:10; Psalm 16:10, 22). See John 1:29, 11:49-52; 1 Corinthians 15:53.

? The Messiah was to be a light to the nations, so that God’s salvation could reach to the ends of the Earth (Isaiah 49:6). Yeshua is the most popular, the most studied and the most influential figure in the history of mankind. He is the most famous Jew who ever lived: more famous than Abraham, more famous than Moses, more famous than King David or any of the prophets, more famous than Freud or Einstein! If people throughout the world know about Israel, or pray to the God of Israel, or read the Holy Scriptures of Israel, it is because of Yeshua. No Jewish person should be indifferent to the fact that this Jewish man has had such a tremendous part in the history of mankind. The love He has inspired, the comfort He has given, the good He has engendered, the hope and joy He has kindled are unequaled in human history. He truly has become the light of the world!

? The Messiah would rise from the dead (Isaiah 53:8-12; Psalm 16:10, 118:21-24; Zechariah 12:10). The New Testament records that after His death and resurrection, Yeshua appeared to a wide variety of Jewish people in varying numbers and under varying circumstances. He appeared to Mary (John 20:11-18); to some other women (Matthew 28:8-10); to Simon Peter (Luke 24:34); to two on the road to Emmaus (Luke 24:13-35); to 10 of the apostles (Luke 24:36-43); to all 11 apostles eight days later (John 20:24-29); then to seven by the Kinneret (the Sea of Galilee – see John 21:1-23). Yeshua appeared to 500 people at once, most of whom were alive and could verify the event when the New Testament was written (1 Cor. 15:6)! Yeshua appeared to His brother James, who became the leader of the Jerusalem Congregation (1 Corinthians 15:7), and to Rabbi Paul of Tarsus, who became better known as the Apostle Paul (Acts 9:1-16). Since the first century there have been millions of people, both Jews and Gentiles (including some of the greatest thinkers, philosophers and scientists), who have claimed to have encountered the resurrected Yeshua. What transformed all of these people? Only one explanation makes sense – He is alive today!

Yeshua’s resurrection makes Him absolutely unique in the history of the world and puts him on a level far higher than any of the prophets of Israel or any other religion or any philosopher. Buddha is still in his tomb. Mohammed is still in his grave. Confucius is still dead. Marx, Lenin and Freud are still in their graves. Only Yeshua has been raised from death! Since God would never allow a liar, a deceiver, or a false Messiah to be resurrected, Yeshua’s resurrection validates His person, His ministry and His message. His resurrection is God’s seal of approval on everything that Yeshua did and taught, and God’s declaration to the world that Yeshua is Messiah and Savior of mankind. Therefore, we ought to pay attention to every word He uttered, since He spoke the truth without any error.

History tells us that only one man – Yeshua of Nazareth – fulfilled these prophecies and many others. No other man in history even comes close. The probability that one person could fulfill all these prophecies by chance is infinitesimally small. There is only one rational conclusion: Yeshua is the Messiah of Israel whom the prophets told us to expect.


The Union of Messianic Jewish Congregations and the Messianic Jewish Alliance of America explain why they believe that Y'shua is the Messiah.

The organization Jews for Jesus has an essay in which the organization explains why Y'shua is the Messiah. The essay begins with the following statement:

It is important to begin by saying that for one who has already made up his or her mind that Jesus is not the Messiah, no amount of evidence will be convincing. But for those who are honest in asking, the evidence speaks for itself.




:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Ruth34611's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:14 PM

Posting a traditional jewish page and posting a messianic jews page is like having 2 experts testifying in court.They are both experts in a certain field yet they both have different conclusions.
Do i accept jesus as the messiah?No.I do think maybe he may have existed but he wasn't the exaggerated demigod in the new testament.


So true.

Hey, Rob. flowerforyou

Conrad_73's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:17 PM


C. Torah Observance

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"


Go ask a Rabbi if this article is true why they would let a False Prophet have...?







Jesus was a Jew

I have always understood that Jesus was, first and foremost, a Jew. Far from his being non-observant, he made it clear he had not come to bypass the law and the prophets. After his death, the first Christian church was based in Jerusalem under his brother James, and all its members were observant Jews. They only dispersed after AD 70. It was Paul who introduced all the nonsense about Jesus being God, one third of a Trinity, being resurrected and so on. Understood properly, Jesus plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism, while the larger role is based on a fiction that became Christianity.


Now why would the Jews allow a FALSE PROHET who is to be stoned a.. "plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism"

Which is he a False Prophet or a Prophet?

another thing anyone who has ever dealt with Jews how many times have you seen them write God as G-D?

Ask this person why Observant jews do this yet he does not? Ask him why they use G-d?

I think we found our false Prophet!!!!





Paul The Globalist!

Milesoftheusa's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:22 PM


Posting a traditional jewish page and posting a messianic jews page is like having 2 experts testifying in court.They are both experts in a certain field yet they both have different conclusions.
Do i accept jesus as the messiah?No.I do think maybe he may have existed but he wasn't the exaggerated demigod in the new testament.


So true.

Hey, Rob. flowerforyou



Its always amazing to me that when it comes to the defense of the Messiah from those who claim he is the Messiah will be silent. Yet those who confess he is not will come out in droves to help each other. These non Believers u can see do not want to say what I am showing to be false. Because they Can't. It is sad is it because I hold to the Torah that it has never been done away?

Matt 12:25-27
"Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation, and every city or house divided against itself will not stand. 26 If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then will his kingdom stand?
NKJV

Matt 12:30
30 He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.
NKJV

Milesoftheusa's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:31 PM



C. Torah Observance

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"


Go ask a Rabbi if this article is true why they would let a False Prophet have...?







Jesus was a Jew

I have always understood that Jesus was, first and foremost, a Jew. Far from his being non-observant, he made it clear he had not come to bypass the law and the prophets. After his death, the first Christian church was based in Jerusalem under his brother James, and all its members were observant Jews. They only dispersed after AD 70. It was Paul who introduced all the nonsense about Jesus being God, one third of a Trinity, being resurrected and so on. Understood properly, Jesus plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism, while the larger role is based on a fiction that became Christianity.


Now why would the Jews allow a FALSE PROHET who is to be stoned a.. "plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism"

Which is he a False Prophet or a Prophet?

another thing anyone who has ever dealt with Jews how many times have you seen them write God as G-D?

Ask this person why Observant jews do this yet he does not? Ask him why they use G-d?

I think we found our false Prophet!!!!





Paul The Globalist!


Explain yourself why Paul the Globalist? If you can?

Ruth34611's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:34 PM



Its always amazing to me that when it comes to the defense of the Messiah from those who claim he is the Messiah will be silent. Yet those who confess he is not will come out in droves to help each other. These non Believers u can see do not want to say what I am showing to be false. Because they Can't. It is sad is it because I hold to the Torah that it has never been done away?

Matt 12:25-27
"Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation, and every city or house divided against itself will not stand. 26 If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then will his kingdom stand?
NKJV

Matt 12:30
30 He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.
NKJV



You quoted me, so I'm assuming this is directed at me. However, I'm not sure what your point is. Can you please explain what you are trying to tell me?

Toodygirl5's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:43 PM
The word "Messiah" means "Anointed One," the name given to the promised Deliverer who would some day come to the people of Israel as their great Savior and Redeemer, "anointed" as Prophet, Priest, and King by God Himself.

Some, of course, are still looking for the fulfillment of these Old Testament promises in the future, when the "Messiah" will come to establish a world kingdom of peace and justice centered around the chosen nation, Israel.

On the other hand, the group of Jewish believers who became the first founders of Christianity were convinced that Jesus of Nazareth was their promised Messiah. The name "Christ" is the Greek equivalent of “Messiah,” so that the name Jesus Christ really means "Jesus the Messiah," or "Jesus the anointed." They preached this truth with such conviction and power that not only many Jews but, later, a still greater host of Gentiles, believed on Jesus, both as the Christ and also as the Lord and Savior of all men.

And indeed they had good reason for such faith. The Old Testament Messianic prophecies were found to be uniquely fulfilled in the Lord Jesus Christ. There are hundreds of these prophecies, so that the possibility of their accidental convergence on any ordinary man is completely ruled out by the laws of probability.

Some of the prophecies are so framed, in fact, as to preclude their fulfillment by anyone living after the first century A.D. For example, the patriarch Jacob said, in Genesis 49:10, "The scepter shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come." The name “Shiloh” is a title of the Messiah, and the prophecy states that Judah's tribe would remain the chief tribe in Israel, in particular providing their kings, until Messiah would come. The prophecy must have been fulfilled prior to the destruction of Judah and Jerusalem in A.D. 70, by which time certainly all semblance of a scepter had departed from Judah.

Similarly the promise was given to King David that the Messiah should be one of his descendants, as the King eternal, the one of whom God said, "I will establish the throne of his kingdom for ever" (II Samuel 7:13). Isaiah said, "There shall come forth a rod out of the stem (literally 'stump') of Jesse (that is David's father), and a Branch shall grow out of his roots" (Isaiah 11:1). This is another name of the Messiah, and indicates that, even after it would appear that the family tree of Jesse has been cut down, yet one Branch will grow out of the stump. Evidently the very last one who could be known to have come of this lineage would finally prove to be the promised Messiah!

This was fulfilled uniquely in Jesus. His foster father, Joseph, was in the royal line from David and thus held the legal right to the throne (Matthew 1:1-16). His mother, Mary, was also a descendant of David, as shown by her genealogy in Luke 3:23-31. But ever since the time of Jesus, it would be quite impossible to establish the legal or biological lineage of any pretender to David's throne, as all the ancient genealogical records were destroyed soon after that.

An even more striking prophecy is given in Daniel 9:24-27. There Daniel was told explicitly that Messiah would come 69 "sabbaths" (that is, 69 sabbatical years - a total of 483 years) after the decree was given to rebuild Jerusalem, which at that time lay in ruins after Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon, had destroyed it.

Such a decree was given later by the Persian emperor. Although the exact date of the decree is somewhat uncertain, the termination date of the prophecy must have been some time in the first century A.D. In fact, it must have been before the destruction of the city and the temple by the Romans in A.D. 70, because the prophecy said quite explicitly: “After (the 483 years) shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself; and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary” (Daniel 9:26). Not only must Messiah come before this destruction, but He was also to be“cut off,” rejected and killed, before it came.

It is obvious that no one but Jesus could have fulfilled these prophecies. The prophecies absolutely preclude any still future Messiah, except that even that hope also will find its fulfillment in the second coming of Christ.

And then, of course, there are still hundreds of other prophecies, all of which were fulfilled by Jesus Christ: His virgin birth (Isaiah 7:14); His birth in Bethlehem (Micah 5:2); His sacrificial death (Isaiah 53:5); His crucifixion (Psalm 22:14-18); His bodily resurrection (Psalm 16:10); and many others. All of these unite in their witness that “Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God” (John 20:31).

The probability that hundreds of such specific predictions, each quite independent of the others, could all be fulfilled concurrently in one individual, is unlikely in the highest degree, especially in view of the miraculous nature of many of them (e.g., the virgin birth, the resurrection, etc.). No rational conclusion seems possible except that Jesus is all He claims - Messiah, Savior, Lord and God.


Conrad_73's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:45 PM




C. Torah Observance

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"


Go ask a Rabbi if this article is true why they would let a False Prophet have...?







Jesus was a Jew

I have always understood that Jesus was, first and foremost, a Jew. Far from his being non-observant, he made it clear he had not come to bypass the law and the prophets. After his death, the first Christian church was based in Jerusalem under his brother James, and all its members were observant Jews. They only dispersed after AD 70. It was Paul who introduced all the nonsense about Jesus being God, one third of a Trinity, being resurrected and so on. Understood properly, Jesus plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism, while the larger role is based on a fiction that became Christianity.


Now why would the Jews allow a FALSE PROHET who is to be stoned a.. "plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism"

Which is he a False Prophet or a Prophet?

another thing anyone who has ever dealt with Jews how many times have you seen them write God as G-D?

Ask this person why Observant jews do this yet he does not? Ask him why they use G-d?

I think we found our false Prophet!!!!





Paul The Globalist!


Explain yourself why Paul the Globalist? If you can?
self explanatory,he created the "Worldwide Church of God"!
Listen to today's Preachers!
Paul This,Paul That!
Today's Christianity is Paul's Construct!

Milesoftheusa's photo
Fri 06/21/13 01:50 PM




Its always amazing to me that when it comes to the defense of the Messiah from those who claim he is the Messiah will be silent. Yet those who confess he is not will come out in droves to help each other. These non Believers u can see do not want to say what I am showing to be false. Because they Can't. It is sad is it because I hold to the Torah that it has never been done away?

Matt 12:25-27
"Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation, and every city or house divided against itself will not stand. 26 If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then will his kingdom stand?
NKJV

Matt 12:30
30 He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.
NKJV



You quoted me, so I'm assuming this is directed at me. However, I'm not sure what your point is. Can you please explain what you are trying to tell me?


well anyone who claims the Yahshua is a fairy tale I welcome them to come up with anything to say it and we will see what proofs we can come up with.

You had quoted
Conrad_73
Paul the Globalists.. so it was to him and u as u agreed with him.

1 thing I will always defend is Yahshua the Messiah. Some thing if u hit on some of the Pearls I will not tell you. but thses pearls I have found most never bring up because the world it has been hidden from. 1 I will say is found in the 1st part of Rev 14. The song sung as if it were new. You have to find it and then a believer will see the importance of it.. all u see their have found it on their own. no one has ever told them.

But 99% of the scriptures is not off base with me.

Back to what u asked. anyone who thinks Paul is a false prophet as I believe Conrad believes I say show me and lets see

RKISIT's photo
Fri 06/21/13 02:43 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Fri 06/21/13 02:54 PM
I always thought Paul was a christian version of Apollonius of tyana.
Matter of fact paul happen to go to the same exact places apollonius did,except apollonius never mentioned about jesus or paul.
Seems the writers of the bible used apollonius adventures to create paul.
Back then who would of checked to verify the authenticity of a holy book.

teadipper's photo
Fri 06/21/13 03:01 PM
Unless you are the sect of Chabad who is waiting for Rebbe Lubavitch to come back, a Messianic Jew is pretty much considered by Jews in the Conservative, Orthodox, Reform and Chabad camps to be a Christian.

Milesoftheusa's photo
Fri 06/21/13 03:05 PM





C. Torah Observance

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"


Go ask a Rabbi if this article is true why they would let a False Prophet have...?







Jesus was a Jew

I have always understood that Jesus was, first and foremost, a Jew. Far from his being non-observant, he made it clear he had not come to bypass the law and the prophets. After his death, the first Christian church was based in Jerusalem under his brother James, and all its members were observant Jews. They only dispersed after AD 70. It was Paul who introduced all the nonsense about Jesus being God, one third of a Trinity, being resurrected and so on. Understood properly, Jesus plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism, while the larger role is based on a fiction that became Christianity.


Now why would the Jews allow a FALSE PROHET who is to be stoned a.. "plays an IMPORTANT role in 2nd-temple Judaism"

Which is he a False Prophet or a Prophet?

another thing anyone who has ever dealt with Jews how many times have you seen them write God as G-D?

Ask this person why Observant jews do this yet he does not? Ask him why they use G-d?

I think we found our false Prophet!!!!





Paul The Globalist!


Explain yourself why Paul the Globalist? If you can?
self explanatory,he created the "Worldwide Church of God"!
Listen to today's Preachers!
Paul This,Paul That!
Today's Christianity is Paul's Construct!



I know all about the WWCG. I lasted 9 months before I had to hit the road and they are nothing like they were before the 90's they lost after Herb died which he made things up as u go like.. if u were divorced u could not remarry and 1000's of people this affected.. then in the late 70's early 80's he had a revelation that u could remarry. Why? he wanted to remarry and so it goes blindly.. That's a false prophet and now their are splinter groups all over the place claiming the other is heresy. they won't even let their members talk with me. or they will be disfellowshipped.. This is so wrong.. Is their ministers so afraid of someone who has never been to a school for religion such a threat to their memberships?

Paul was a chosen vessel by Yahshua. He was at Stephens stoning in Acts 7 then in Acts 9 he is struck blind for 3 days and has a change of heart. like he died and rose again u could say.

Paul replaced who was chosen to take judas place at the end of Acts 1 before the coming of the Holy Spirit on all of them in Acts 2.

It was very hard for the Disciples to have anything to do with them He helped stone Stephen for saying the Holy name Yahweh.

It says at the end of acts 7 they held their ears and rushed him and killed Stephen.

The only reason they would hold their ears was because of what I have said before the name of Yahweh was to Holy to speak. the main word the jews use for Yahweh is Hashem which mean the Name.. Christians YHWH was replaced by the four letters LORD over 6900 times in the OT alone. If Moshe and the prophets ect recorded this over 6900 times more than any word or name in the OT don't u think Yahweh's name is important?

Paul when blinded could not explain away this and he was 1 of the foremost Jews condemning Yahshua and now he is Praising him.. Wait a minute whats going on.. The ones who were with him and were blinded but could hear Yahshua speak from the heavens was the only reason the Disciples accepted Paul.

In the mouths of 2 or 3 witnesses let everything be established. Kind of like when u r accused of a crime.. 1 witness is not really enough .. has to be DNA or another witness at least. No different than today. After this many do not realize but in Galations 1 it says before Paul went back to Jerusalem he went to the desert and learned for 3 years.. Where did Yahshua go as soon as the Spirit of Life lighted on him as a Dove of Peace? TO THE DESERT. He was Yahshua's Chosen vessel. Why? His Zeal got turned around against the jews. Then the Jews went after him saying he did not keep the Law of Moshe. Read what acts 21 has to say.

Acts 21:17-34

17 And when we had come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. 18 On the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present. 19 When he had greeted them, he told in detail those things which God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. 20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord. And they said to him, "You see, brother, how many myriads of Jews there are who have believed, and they are all zealous for the law; 21 but they have been informed about you that you teach all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. 22 What then? The assembly must certainly meet, for they will hear that you have come. 23 Therefore do what we tell you: We have four men who have taken a vow. 24 Take them and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads, and that all may know that those things of which they were informed concerning you are nothing, but that you yourself also walk orderly and keep the law. 25 But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing, except that they should keep themselves from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality."

26 Arrested in the Temple


Then Paul took the men, and the next day, having been purified with them, entered the temple to announce the expiration of the days of purification, at which time an offering should be made for each one of them.

27 Now when the seven days were almost ended, the Jews from Asia, seeing him in the temple, stirred up the whole crowd and laid hands on him, 28 crying out, "Men of Israel, help! This is the man who teaches all men everywhere against the people, the law, and this place; and furthermore he also brought Greeks into the temple and has defiled this holy place." 29(For they had previously seen Trophimus the Ephesian with him in the city, whom they supposed that Paul had brought into the temple.)

30 And all the city was disturbed; and the people ran together, seized Paul, and dragged him out of the temple; and immediately the doors were shut. 31 Now as they were seeking to kill him, news came to the commander of the garrison that all Jerusalem was in an uproar. 32 He immediately took soldiers and centurions, and ran down to them. And when they saw the commander and the soldiers, they stopped beating Paul. 33 Then the commander came near and took him, and commanded him to be bound with two chains; and he asked who he was and what he had done. 34 And some among the multitude cried one thing and some another.
NKJV

What Paul did and the Temple was still standing. Was end the Nazorite vow of Numbers 6 that like John the Baptist several others vowed before Yahweh to do and how/why this vow would end. Its all their from Acts 21 in Numbers 6.

Paul kept the law so did all the disciples.
This very reason is why Paul as a Roman citizen appealed to Ceaser and they took him to Rome because Paul was to be a vessel to the Gentiles and what more of a Pagan place to go and spread the good news than ROME!!!!

It says the sayings of Paul are hard to be understood that people take them and twist them.. here was the beginning of their twisting Pauls work.

Paul went to the Gentiles and Peter went to the Jews until he got his mind changed in Acts 10 and 11. Paul never broke the law porpusely


Previous 1 3 4 5