... and who was responsible for satan and hell?

Another one of god's screw ups!

"Doesnt look like he doing well at all in the polls this morning, Don"

"But here's the weather"

But you purport to know about god. So surely you should be asking him.
Are you saying starvation is not god's fault?

Do you thank god before a meal for the food on your table? If so, why??
He did not put it there.

If you say "Thank the lord for this food", you are stating that he had responsibility in putting it there.

Therefore, if he gives food to you, why does he withhold it from others?
If you think he does not withhold it from others, then you better not thank him for the food you have.

Another way to think of it is this way. You might say "Praise the lord that those 80 people survived that plane crash."
But you don't blame the lord for those 100 people died in the plane crash...
Believers are more than happy to praise their god during the good events, yet they never blame him for the bad.

Lets assume your god exists.
Just two questions.
Why doesnt he/she/it feed the starving millions in Africa?
Why doesnt he/she/it make it rain in the places it needs water?

Jax, that is the most sensible thing I have read.

But, as the US is a nation of 300million people getting agreement on who to have as the Prez is always going to be impossible.

But, if you dont vote, you dont have a right to whine about which idiot you get in.

But if you do vote, then you have spoken.

I personally dont think that voting for independant is a wasted vote.

If I remember rightly, didnt the independants' votes speak loudly by taking votes away from a "title contender" a while ago?

Whichever set of idiots you get in, within 4 years half the population will be unhappy with it, and within 6 years 75% of the population will be looking for a way of getting rid of him/her ....

What makes you think you are different to the rest of us?
Why should you be able to post religious "poetry" and not get it moved to the religious thread?

Welcome.
You are the first I have read about, and it interests me enough to read more.

Makes a change from the bleeding heart god-squad we normally get on here.
Thank you

You are not the first person to say that ... lmao

Look at it this way.

If all those who believe in a greater power are right then we will all go somewhere else (unless we are already there)

If all those who dont believe are right, then it wont make a blind bit of difference as we will all be space dust.

Either way, it will be a very good experiement.

Im backing Dr Hawking though

Im just hoping that it destroys the universe.

Then we can see if there is a god or not!

Fair thoughts, however when a small church like the church of England can take £3billion in revenue a year, with outgoings of £900million, I think the money to member ratio is going to be very high.

Even if all of the people in the UK were involved in the church (58million) this would still be £2.1 billion divided by 58 million = phenomenal amounts of money.

So then if you looked at the US catholic church?

As I am a Brit, you will have to forgive me if I dont know the first phrase of the 1st Amendment.

I just think that religious organisations are a drain on the resources of the country, and therefore should be made to make a legal contribution.

I think it is an excellent idea.

It is a business. Robbing the rich and the poor, and ..... keeping it!!

Standard rate of business tax.
Property tax
All the clergy should be forced to pay income tax.
Capitol Gains tax!

It should all be levied against the respective religions

They are already robbing the non-believers, so why not make them pay what is rightly due.

You wont see me there.

Im too busy being a non-believer.

Im going to be fish food!

Dont be sad .... Stand up and shout it from the roof.
Religion is a con!

I will quite happily say it.

The Church of England (which is not a large church) has incomings of £3.94BILLION!!!

Thats about $7Billion

Where did it get all that from? From the parishoners of course!!

Its yearly outgoings are £900million, ($1.8billion) making a yearly profit of £3Billion!

... and they dont pay tax.

The church is a bunch of thieving, robbing fraudsters and people are happy to buy into it!

Now how many people in the US? How much does the Catholic church make out of the US?
Does the church pay tax?

I hate it! The poor get robbed and the church gets richer!

Is there a xtian that could deny that, according to your bible, Jesus is the one and only same personage as the God of the Old Testament?

Did Jesus condemm ANY of his father's massacres?
No.

In Matt 5:48 he says "Be ye therefore perfect, even as I or your Father in Heaven is perfect."

Do you think Jesus would have questioned any of his father's actions, like the many acts of genocide that litter the pages of the Old Testament?
No.

Remember what Jesus said when he gave the Lord's Prayer to his followers- "Our Father who art in heaven... thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven."

Do you think Jesus would have ever disobeyed his father's commands, like when he ordered that his servants should "kill everyone that breathes" upon their entry to the Promised Land?
No.

In John chapter 10 verse 30, Jesus said: "I and the Father are one." Jesus would have been swinging a sword, hacking nonviolent men, women and children to death, right along side of Joshua and his armies of Israelites! Imagine that. Jesus, the Prince of Peace, splitting a child in two with his blood-drenched sword.

In John 1:1, we read "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

In verse 14, we read: "The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us." We are told explicitly that Jesus Christ IS THE GOD OF THE OLD TESTAMENT!

You probably already accept this.

But, logical extension, you must also accept therefore that;
- it was Jesus Christ who ordered the Israelites to slaughter millions of defenseless men, women and children in the conquest of Canaan,
- it was Jesus Christ who killed every firstborn child in Egypt,
- it was Jesus Christ who ordered king Saul to butcher thousands of children and babies in the genocide of the Amalakites,
- it was Jesus Christ who ordered the Israellites to capture and mass-rape 32,000 young girls of the Midianite tribe, after killing their families,
- it was Jesus Christ who struck dead 50,000 innocent people at Beshemish for merely LOOKING at the ark of the covenant,
- it was Jesus Christ who caused the painful asphixiation of every man, woman, child and animal on the face of the earth during the flood of Noah, and
- it was Jesus Christ who condemmed every person ever born to a state of eternal suffering, all because 6000 years ago a curious and naive woman ate a piece of fruit.

err ... my questions would also be a little close to the edge of the standards of decency ...

Although I will have to enquire of the spin speed of your washing machine

Someone that I know and love studied under Krishnamurti.

I have that book and it is amazing!

Damn! Im not ... I just chose the path of religious repugnance and have stayed there!

I hate being a sheep! baaa baaa

So unless there is a traumatic event in which the person sees that ludicrous nature of their religion, they are doomed to be drawn back in to their cults?

Attitude adjustment.

Does the High Priestess (may warm oil be upon her) think that in any given group, as human beings have the need to belong, any attitude adjustment would normally preclude said adjustee from ceratin activities within that group.

Example.
Lets say, in the unlikely event, any of the god squad here decided that we were right, and god was, indeed, a figment of their imagination.
Do you think that they would brave their peer group of squaddies and tell them that they are leaving the church of the poisoned mind and pursuing life-long happiness by using the bible only as a door wedge to the crapper?

How would their peer group react?
Would the enlightened ex-squaddie be able to handle the shock, horror and subsequent lessening of social acceptance.

Instead of prolonging human life in the developing worlds, do you not think that time would be better spent on developing crops and food for the underdeveloped worlds?

We have a huge continent where there are people who starve to death because drought inhibits their abilities to grow basic food stuffs.

Gene therapy is necessary, but develop the genes in food first.

Lets get all humanity on a level were they live past 30 years old.

Someone in here said (paraphrased) if god didnt want us to develop gene therapy then he would not have given us the skills to do it.

If you believe in god, then you have to believe this is right.

After all, your god doesnt inhibit free will - does he?

Her very tall un-cute German boyfriend!