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Topic:
Slavery
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I am curious why one would take it personally (by asking if THey personally owned slaves) just because someone else acknowledges slavery descendants or their struggles. That's like listening to a rape survivor and responding "Was I the one who raped you?" I mean if they accuse you 'your people owned my people' that's one thing, because not all whites had slaves. It seems however sort of odd projection for one to jump to personal defensiveness when no one personally accuses THEM of anything. That being said, I was born in the 60s and raised by parents who were born well before the 60's. The laws far from made an instant change in treatment and attitude. The topic is about slavery, and blacks were not the only slaves(in world history), but as a black person, MY connection to slavery(in AMerican history) is obviously going to be more specific to blacks and slavery. I would love to read the perceptions of Irish, Jews, or any other people regarding whatever forms of SLAVERY are in their heritage too. I am saying what I have experienced. Many seem to think that all whites were pro-slavery or ownes slaves. I am coming from the other side of it. My people were Irish (scum of the Earth) and Dutch (didn't believe in slavery) This topic was brought to modern day (instead of strictly slavery). But racist come from all races. Yes, I have experienced racism myself. Slavery was a long time ago. Time to heal. It isn't one sided and many races have suffered....not just blacks. Why assume just black slaves? sure many races. the apartheid regime that enslaved south africa were dutch .slavery is not past.it has only changed methods. |
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Topic:
Slavery
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Are we really freeeeeeeee? when u need to ask then u r not hhh me neither if that makes u happy Membership card to be in the system (social security card) u allow me entrance into ur club of the caged, is that right? |
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Topic:
Slavery
Edited by
rawand_
on
Mon 02/20/17 07:47 AM
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But there should be no scars from something that happened to your ancestors and it has absolutely no bearing on current life. Actually I think it is the basis for discrimination, white supremacy, etc which are very much a continued part of current life. In addition, family history is held dear to many, as are old photographs of our ancestors. We keep photo albums and search genealogy because we want to know 'who we are'. If you are white, you probably dont have photographs of slaves. If you are black, you may. In fact you may be related to white plantation owners. The reasons for the latter are nothing short of ugly. human history leaves its imprint on all of us Its no secret that women in this country continue to make less than men for the same work. That stat is even worse if youre a Black, Latino, or Asian woman. I also have family history that does in fact have discrimination in it.. a lot of it actually. and my ancestors too were mistreated.. terribly. actually 1 million of my kind died.. in the Potato famine. And the Irish sure do know discrimination all of which is very well documented, all of which is part of the American history. As is other ethnic groups. And while my relatives have had it hard and my ancestors had it even harder. I never heard a word of that growing up. I knew what happened to " my kind.. my people" but as a family we never dwelled on that. And in the all Irish neighborhood that I grew up in, we never hear about it. Nobody ever dwelled on it. We just continued to better ourselves My point is this, many ethnic groups had it tough.. many.. but they overcame the hardships, the injustices and the outright wrongs and moved on. Improving their live, generation by generation. upward. And I am not saying the " world " is right.. there is a lot of work still to be done. But You remember where you come from...what you are. but that is not a driving factor in your life.. it is history.. something to gauge how far you have come. That happened to my history teacher who told our class in college. As recent as the 1960's. Traffic stops can turn fatal if you are black. Today. As for discrimination: Do your job interviewers see that youre a white male when you walk in? I dont think we're on the same page. We prolly wont ever be. Nothing I can say is new to you Im sure. Youre just not moved by any of it. Looks like a case of 'Ive got mine. Too bad about anybody else.' no.. where not going to agree. And no I'm not moved by it. Why.. because it is history.. stop living in it and you will go further.. and feel less bitter. Were the Irish even hung?.. actually they were.. try looking up the Molly Maguire's.. actually try looking up the Irish.. you may just get a education in discrimination.. its wasn't a black only thing.. ya know. Better yet, take a stroll thru the cemeteries in Louisiana.. take a look at the old headstones.. and all the Irish last names.. you know why?.. because back in the plantation days ( no us Irish folks didn't own any.. cause we were the scum of the earth back then) the Irish were put to work in the swamps before the slaves were... because it was thought the slaves were more valuable then a Irishman... so the Irish died of disease, snakebite or gator attacks.. all to support their families. I have no idea what the people I interview see.. and frankly could care less. I hire the best for the job. And btw.. scores in my company are black.. why.. not because of their color.. but because they are the best for that job... period. And do I have mine?.. yes I do.. and I got it the old fashioned way... I earned it No whining.. no crying foul..no silver spoon. went out there and earned it.. not really a novel approach.. but when all you do is complain.. and look in the past..it doesn't leave much time for positive things.. does it. Have a nice night ;) my friend dont forget that the past created the present. to understand to not to do the same mistakes over and over again we need to understand what really happened and not what was written that happened and that needs much more than just not forgetting. it must be analyzed again and again it must become visible and understandable for the crowds. iam not living in the past but i try to avoid stepping backwards as many societies nowadays do urged or even forced by the so called high developed and modern countries. to understand u cant just look at a phrase u must see the whole. see the world as a whole, see urself as part of the whole. how can we step forward when we have no background no fundamental structure, no consciousness of the evil side of mankind. just forgetting is too easy. we have to go on ofc, but with wisdom knowledge and consciousness not blindly as an easy target. My friend.. as far as I can see ( in America) the past is not being repeated. And I am sure there is slavery in other parts of the world, but there is none anymore in my part of the world. And hasn't been for 150 years. So, my point is this. At what age does the slavery topic go ( and stay) where it belongs.. in the history books. At what time do the 3-4 or 5 times removed people stop using it as a crutch. Is it 175 years, 200, 300?.. when As I stated, blacks were one of many ethic groups that had a tough time early in American history. For Christ sake, we hunted the American Indians down took their land then slaughtered them. Time to get over it. sry but i think we cant become friends. u r the poorest kind of slaves who doesnt know he is a slave. when they made u believe it is ok to forget and to leave it to the historians then u r an alpha slave in their system. the powers changes the methods changes the era changes but oppression is constant especially in oh so free america. i dont mean to offend u i want u to wake up |
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Topic:
Slavery
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I'm tired of hearing about the silly crap.. Black people were making slaves of each other way before white people thought of it.. No one in my family was rich enough to own slaves, so I carry no guilt... how often do you 'hear' about it really? there has been some form of slavery on every continent throughout history,, but as it pertains to THIS continent,, it was primarily a race based hierarchy,,,,, families separated AGAINST THEIR WILL, stripped of the right to share knowledge of their ancestry, stripped of their very names, born into the status of mere property,, BORN INTO IT ,denied the opportunity to be educated, families separated AGAINST THEIR WILL,,,, that recurring hierarcy, being passed down the culture in its values and standards generation after generation for nearly 365 years(slavery 246 years, and segregation/jim crow for another 100) out of a period of 398 years (1619-2017)sets a pretty deep FOUNDATION of racial hierarchy in the US culture something that's been there 365 years, will not be even close to being corrected in only 50 years,, especially when so many believed that all work was done in only a decade (60s and 70s) it is never about white vs black, because there were whites and blacks who fought to end it,,,,,,,,its about systemic racism and oppression against blacks,,,,,so no one is asking any white person to feel 'guilt' its just necessary for people, of all races, to feel 'aknowledgment' for what happened and feel 'responsible' for making sure the disparate impact is not continually reinforced,, well said |
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Topic:
Slavery
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Are we really freeeeeeeee? when u need to ask then u r not hhh me neither if that makes u happy and i think some few ppl are really free, despite nothing is absolute |
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Topic:
Stigma and a Brave New World
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no one has forced anyone to START taking drugs its like blaming fast food restaurants for peoples lives being 'destroyed' by obesity or obesity related death and as a rape survivor, yes,, one can choose to overcome it or wallow in it,, however 'hard' it may be is irrelevant,,,to the choice being there,,, and not the same as being KILLED by someones hands intentionally,,,no one gets the choice to no longer be dead if you are still breathing, your life has not 'ended' I have no soft spots for those in prison, I have a human heart for human mistakes and bad choices,,and giving humans a chance to grow, learn, and improve,,, I have a human heart for human mistakes and bad choices,, and giving humans a chance to grow, learn, and improve,,, ___________________________________________________________________ I have a heart as well.. some say too big at times. But I also am not naïve Rape is not a bad decision..it is a calculated decision.. it is a sever character flaw.. and most men who do rape.. do not get caught the first time. Drug distribution is not a bad decision, it is a financial decision that was made to line the dealers pockets with money at the expense of the people he peddled the poison to. What you perceive as a mistake, I perceive as a calculated choices they made.. over time. And they can grow... in prison, where they belong.  when will we see the others. when will we not judge what we dont understand. when will we learn to tolerate even if we cant relate. why do we kill to oppress and not to survive as nature thought us. why am i good and he is bad. so many questions and no plausible answers. someone enlighten me, where is jesus Stigmatizing is saying you really do not forgive. Our justice system is not fair. Innocent until proven guilty is a myth. Just watch the Tv or media. true stigmatism without a verdict. who gets the best defense? pretty easy to know who has the most money or what lawyer will get the most publicity to make more money. If you need a public defender do you think you get the justice that a person who has so much money it is no object gets? True justice would be by a panel of judges who through thier experience in the law of the land would distribute justice equally no matter what your status in society is. law would be law for all. mercy and justice go hand in hand equally. Forgiveness would be the law of the land. If your crime/s are that bad then you should be as dead to the rest not to poison the them. Never to be in society again whatever that judgement may be. i agree with u. but i am skeptical about the judges cuz they will have the power then and can use it for own purposes. as long as there are some who have significantly more power then the rest there will always be the risk of misuse. we should try either to spread the given legal power or to eliminate the legislative. democracy brings no justice never did. we need new and less norms or no norms, no legal powers just communities and arrangements or many regional independent powers- like dividing usa in thousands of independent governments. there would be more variety more development more justice and less manipulation and less hatred. |
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Gender equality is an ideal that not everyone is comfortable with. Tge world being in a constsnt stste if change, there isn't always someone to fill a specific gender role. Men are single parents. Women ate single parents. There comes a point where you don't wirk to fulfill a gender role but become self sufficient because it's the only way to meet life's demands actually i hoped that ppl will try to answer the questions. lets say complete equality is even impossible to achieve. thats not the point. my point or my question is what do we expect when we demand gender equality.? my personal vision of G.E. for example shows the same rewarding for the same action with the same outcome. men r physically stronger so they can carry more if thats the demand and should be paied more, otherwise simple business concepts would be weakened. contrary women can stand cold temperatures better than man, if the demand is to act in the cold and she is more productive than him, than its her ability that justifies a higher reward. the mentioned examples dont mean equal reward per person but its equal reward per outcome. but in an office job for expl. rewarding should not vary. another important point is the women get the babies. how should that be rewarded? the rewarding here should not be material i would say. for expl women with babies or kids should always have priority when waiting in line or when getting an medical treatment or when she starts working again.... ofc if they r divorced he should have to pay and to care for the child. That said: In terms of equality for women, the hope is that we would have equal opportunity, and respect. Some day, I hope there is no such thing as 'pink collar jobs' or sexual harassment, rape culture, or 3% of convicted rapists serving jail time, or the need for the Lilly Ledbetter Act. All these tell women they are not respected or valued in the usa culture. Im sure youve heard the expression: "Feminism is the radical notion that women are people" There are folks that will shame people who support feminism and try to make it seem like its bad in some way like that it means a hatred for men or that women want to be men etc. Women want to continue to be women and be respected anyway. Men and women have differences. Why not value each other for all that chit. thx my friend, i agree with u completely. hhh cool so iam inventing words |
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do u know how it is like not to date who u want or to wear what u like. i dont but my siss do. and i knew many of their secrets, gave alibis for dating. did u know their word is less worth in the court. did u know they inherit half the amount of the sons. did u know that they get constantly annoyed by taxi drivers they rent cuz they live little more freely than most other women here. or did u know that they got and will get death threats cuz they defend women rights and hide women in danger, of their own family. did u know my sis was the first girl in the city driving a pickup to university and ppl were talking and looking at her like an alien. i guess not. however i have to say that iam kind of disappointed that no one posted a serious feedback to the topic, but r posting at the same time in other threats demands on their rights and about the unfairness in the world. Ok this puts things in a bit more perspective for me. I read the topic headline and then EACH post and couldn't make heads or tails out of it. You are correct I DON'T know what it is to live like that I DO read about it and yet it would be insulting to say I "know" what it is like. What I do know is I was blessed to be born in the USA here I believe anyone can achieve their dreams through hard work etc. I do believe in the equality of men and women. In this country we can and do step into each others roles. I do believe that we all have to strive to accept others not enable but encourage. I do believe in equality based on a persons earned merits. Not what they look like, what career they choose, the colour of ones skin isn't something that doesn't factor in in my world. Gender also doesn't come to factor for me at all. Male or female both are vital and we both are able to share or carry lifes load Is this more of what you were looking for. If this post would have been in your opening post it would have given me a bit more clarity and I wouldnt have been lost U know despite all that all of my siss decided on their to come back to Kurdistan as they have austrian citizenship. someone has to face the fight and they r fighting well. everyone have to demand his her own rights noone else will do it for u. men can be supporters, as i am, but the fight and struggle and pain has to be carried on their shoulders mainly, otherwise they wont be taken serious. |
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Gender equality is an ideal that not everyone is comfortable with. Tge world being in a constsnt stste if change, there isn't always someone to fill a specific gender role. Men are single parents. Women ate single parents. There comes a point where you don't wirk to fulfill a gender role but become self sufficient because it's the only way to meet life's demands actually i hoped that ppl will try to answer the questions. lets say complete equality is even impossible to achieve. thats not the point. my point or my question is what do we expect when we demand gender equality.? my personal vision of G.E. for example shows the same rewarding for the same action with the same outcome. men r physically stronger so they can carry more if thats the demand and should be paied more, otherwise simple business concepts would be weakened. contrary women can stand cold temperatures better than man, if the demand is to act in the cold and she is more productive than him, than its her ability that justifies a higher reward. the mentioned examples dont mean equal reward per person but its equal reward per outcome. but in an office job for expl. rewarding should not vary. another important point is the women get the babies. how should that be rewarded? the rewarding here should not be material i would say. for expl women with babies or kids should always have priority when waiting in line or when getting an medical treatment or when she starts working again.... ofc if they r divorced he should have to pay and to care for the child. |
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Topic:
Slavery
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The scars of the oppression of one race, or gender, over another last long after the oppression has officially ended. I remember the Jim Crow laws of fifties, and the riots and demonstrations of the sixties. We have come a long way in this country since then. But racism and sexism still thrives.  it must be thematised again and again and u as a witness have the power to raise awareness. we all have power in some way yet we r not aware how powerful we really r.
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Topic:
Slavery
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The scars of the oppression of one race, or gender, over another last long after the oppression has officially ended. I remember the Jim Crow laws of fifties, and the riots and demonstrations of the sixties. We have come a long way in this country since then. But racism and sexism still thrives. it must be thematised again and again and u as a witness have the power to raise awareness. we all have power in some way yet we r not aware how powerful we really r.
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Topic:
Slavery
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Are we really freeeeeeeee? when u need to ask then u r not hhh me neither if that makes u happy |
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Topic:
Slavery
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But there should be no scars from something that happened to your ancestors and it has absolutely no bearing on current life. Actually I think it is the basis for discrimination, white supremacy, etc which are very much a continued part of current life. In addition, family history is held dear to many, as are old photographs of our ancestors. We keep photo albums and search genealogy because we want to know 'who we are'. If you are white, you probably dont have photographs of slaves. If you are black, you may. In fact you may be related to white plantation owners. The reasons for the latter are nothing short of ugly. human history leaves its imprint on all of us Its no secret that women in this country continue to make less than men for the same work. That stat is even worse if youre a Black, Latino, or Asian woman. I also have family history that does in fact have discrimination in it.. a lot of it actually. and my ancestors too were mistreated.. terribly. actually 1 million of my kind died.. in the Potato famine. And the Irish sure do know discrimination all of which is very well documented, all of which is part of the American history. As is other ethnic groups. And while my relatives have had it hard and my ancestors had it even harder. I never heard a word of that growing up. I knew what happened to " my kind.. my people" but as a family we never dwelled on that. And in the all Irish neighborhood that I grew up in, we never hear about it. Nobody ever dwelled on it. We just continued to better ourselves My point is this, many ethnic groups had it tough.. many.. but they overcame the hardships, the injustices and the outright wrongs and moved on. Improving their live, generation by generation. upward. And I am not saying the " world " is right.. there is a lot of work still to be done. But You remember where you come from...what you are. but that is not a driving factor in your life.. it is history.. something to gauge how far you have come. That happened to my history teacher who told our class in college. As recent as the 1960's. Traffic stops can turn fatal if you are black. Today. As for discrimination: Do your job interviewers see that youre a white male when you walk in? I dont think we're on the same page. We prolly wont ever be. Nothing I can say is new to you Im sure. Youre just not moved by any of it. Looks like a case of 'Ive got mine. Too bad about anybody else.' no.. where not going to agree. And no I'm not moved by it. Why.. because it is history.. stop living in it and you will go further.. and feel less bitter. Were the Irish even hung?.. actually they were.. try looking up the Molly Maguire's.. actually try looking up the Irish.. you may just get a education in discrimination.. its wasn't a black only thing.. ya know. Better yet, take a stroll thru the cemeteries in Louisiana.. take a look at the old headstones.. and all the Irish last names.. you know why?.. because back in the plantation days ( no us Irish folks didn't own any.. cause we were the scum of the earth back then) the Irish were put to work in the swamps before the slaves were... because it was thought the slaves were more valuable then a Irishman... so the Irish died of disease, snakebite or gator attacks.. all to support their families. I have no idea what the people I interview see.. and frankly could care less. I hire the best for the job. And btw.. scores in my company are black.. why.. not because of their color.. but because they are the best for that job... period. And do I have mine?.. yes I do.. and I got it the old fashioned way... I earned it No whining.. no crying foul..no silver spoon. went out there and earned it.. not really a novel approach.. but when all you do is complain.. and look in the past..it doesn't leave much time for positive things.. does it. Have a nice night ;) my friend dont forget that the past created the present. to understand to not to do the same mistakes over and over again we need to understand what really happened and not what was written that happened and that needs much more than just not forgetting. it must be analyzed again and again it must become visible and understandable for the crowds. iam not living in the past but i try to avoid stepping backwards as many societies nowadays do urged or even forced by the so called high developed and modern countries. to understand u cant just look at a phrase u must see the whole. see the world as a whole, see urself as part of the whole. how can we step forward when we have no background no fundamental structure, no consciousness of the evil side of mankind. just forgetting is too easy. we have to go on ofc, but with wisdom knowledge and consciousness not blindly as an easy target. |
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The world is my religion. Nature is my temple. ******************************************************* LOL  No matter in what order they come as PERSONAL PRIORITY, to each individual, they are the FOUNDATION of the NEXT NEW WORLD TO COME....SOON    ***********************************************************   so true so sad |
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Ok NOW I get to say it I am totally lost in this thread. thanks for ur contribution. |
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do u know how it is like not to date who u want or to wear what u like. i dont but my siss do. and i knew many of their secrets, gave alibis for dating. did u know their word is less worth in the court. did u know they inherit half the amount of the sons. did u know that they get constantly annoyed by taxi drivers they rent cuz they live little more freely than most other women here. or did u know that they got and will get death threats cuz they defend women rights and hide women in danger, of their own family. did u know my sis was the first girl in the city driving a pickup to university and ppl were talking and looking at her like an alien. i guess not.
however i have to say that iam kind of disappointed that no one posted a serious feedback to the topic, but r posting at the same time in other threats demands on their rights and about the unfairness in the world. |
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The world is my religion. Nature is my temple. ******************************************************* LOL No matter in what order they come as PERSONAL PRIORITY, to each individual, they are the FOUNDATION of the NEXT NEW WORLD TO COME....SOON
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agnostic born muslim.
actually i meant earth is my temple as it is material. nature whereas is soul, love, power, the change of states, the gravity and the light philosophy is not definitive my friend |
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Topic:
Stigma and a Brave New World
Edited by
rawand_
on
Sun 02/19/17 06:11 PM
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no one has forced anyone to START taking drugs its like blaming fast food restaurants for peoples lives being 'destroyed' by obesity or obesity related death and as a rape survivor, yes,, one can choose to overcome it or wallow in it,, however 'hard' it may be is irrelevant,,,to the choice being there,,, and not the same as being KILLED by someones hands intentionally,,,no one gets the choice to no longer be dead if you are still breathing, your life has not 'ended' I have no soft spots for those in prison, I have a human heart for human mistakes and bad choices,,and giving humans a chance to grow, learn, and improve,,, I have a human heart for human mistakes and bad choices,, and giving humans a chance to grow, learn, and improve,,, ___________________________________________________________________ I have a heart as well.. some say too big at times. But I also am not naïve Rape is not a bad decision..it is a calculated decision.. it is a sever character flaw.. and most men who do rape.. do not get caught the first time. Drug distribution is not a bad decision, it is a financial decision that was made to line the dealers pockets with money at the expense of the people he peddled the poison to. What you perceive as a mistake, I perceive as a calculated choices they made.. over time. And they can grow... in prison, where they belong. when will we see the others. when will we not judge what we dont understand. when will we learn to tolerate even if we cant relate. why do we kill to oppress and not to survive as nature thought us. why am i good and he is bad. so many questions and no plausible answers. someone enlighten me, where is jesus
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Topic:
Stigma and a Brave New World
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What about those who are victimzed because of innocence, ignorance or pressured by society? Are they also to be stigmatized for acting out of ignorance or fear? The kid who fled from a war torn country and ended up in a crime ridden neighborhood. That kid had to join a gang because otherwise he would get jumped by both sides. What about the woman who was shown false divorce papers and ended up with an illegitimate child? Is she to be permanently ostracized for having been a trusting oerson? Also every story has 2 sides. The stigma idea sounds like something from the Scarlet Letter. People were too ready to judge her and forget that it was a priest who fathered that child. Many people often onky see what they want and judge a skewed picture unfortunately the ppl today are so full of hate and prejudice as a consequence of the manipulative machinery directed by the powers, which is a highly positive feedback for the constructors, that the social attitudes towards others get more and more lost. and here i refer back to the top of the topic "to do right", most people believe they r right, so does the killer and the mother who r for sure wrong in someoneelses eyes somewhere and right in another ones eyes. right and wrong is not most important. to be able to accept the unknown shows greatness in character, ofc as long as its not harmful to someone. |
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