i'm not sure how your thinking obeseness is not more than diet... your body can't make fat from nothing... bad analogy, people eat what they CHOOSE, and commit crimes as they CHOOSE... blaming society is another choice... liberals just seem to think everything is someone elses fault for some reason...

Hate it when that happens.

I don't consider myself poor because I am in good health and I have a roof over my head and I eat every day. The universe provides me with what ever I need. But according to the national standards I am in the poverty level when you look at my actual income.

Some people might use poverty as an excuse to steal to survive but most people know the difference between right and wrong above and beyond what society may have laws about. No person anywhere is aware of every law so it is easy to break a law. But most everyone knows right from wrong. Those who don't, are mentally disabled.

I said obesity IS more than just ones diet

one person can eat the same number of calories as another and not have the same result, depending upon what EXERCISE accompanies that diet

so, obesity isnt JUST diet,,,its calores consumed AS WELL AS colories expended that leads to the weight gain, and genetics also play a part in weight tendencies,,,,

yes, people eat what they choose, and then they exercise or dont ecercise as they choose

but people who are in a house with only celery have much less to CHOOSE from than those in a grocery store

and those in impoverished communities have alot more 'amoral' choices and much fewer positive choices presented to them than those in suburbia,,,,

who said criminals are the victims? there isnt one slanted stat that will convince me that crime occurs in a vacuum strictly (or even 70 %) because of genetics


there are many factors which nurture a child to grow into a criminal , MANY FACTORS, and race doesnt predetermine anything,,,,


there is nothing stupid about looking at actual ALTERABLE variables when seeking to improve a situation,,,,

and you are right, most people arent criminals, black white or otherwise

so that is the point of refuting nonsense claiming that crime tendency has to do with race,,,,,

msharmony, this debate started because you tried to establish a link between crimes committed by African-Americans and the poverty rate among African-Americans. Because you did that, some people are interpreting your words as an attempt to make excuses for African-Americans who choose to commit crimes.

Perhaps others are misinterpreting your words. Perhaps they are not.

Now, since you claim to be a Christian, I will give a Christian response to your claim about crime.

Psalm 14:2-3 says, "The Lord looks down from heaven on the children of man, to see if there are any who understand, who seek after God. They have all turned aside; together they have become corrupt; there is none who does good, not even one."(ESV)

In Mark 10:18 Jesus says, "No one is good except God alone."(ESV)

From a Christian perspective, a person chooses to commit a crime because the person has a sin nature.

Being that every person currently on Earth has a sin nature (according to the Bible), every person is going to choose to sin no matter what her/his economic status is.

A person living in poverty may choose to commit a crime, but the choice is the result of the person's sin nature, not a result of the person's financial situation.

That is why it is wrong to imply or insinuate that members of a particular racial or ethnic group commit crimes because those members experienced poverty. People of all racial groups and ethnic groups are equally sinful.

nope the debate was equating gun laws with gun violence

which I was explaiing isnt a simple correlation becaues gun violence is not JUST the gun laws but the culture

THEN INVICTUS introduced race on the first page with statistics

and YOU introduced it on the second page with statistics as well

I have been the sole person who is actually a black person in this thread and have been RESPONDING to others racial suggestions regarding crime and gun violence,,,,

,,,but to go on,,,

Im not talking the broad subject of sin, Im talking about violent crime,,,,,a specific type of sin

yes, every person has a sin nature, but everyone is not born with a nature to commit violent crime

violence is NURTURED from childhood, it is learned, it is taught, it is not that childs conscious CHOICE what reality they get born into and what reality they are surrounded by,,,,


thank goodness it is a small percentage who are nurtured into the criminals they become as adults, thank goodness most of us sinners are brought up to be non violent , but people who are DESPERATE are emotionally ill, and just as much as being born with a physical handicap makes them more vulnerable in certain situations than non handicapped might be,,,those with the emotional illness of desperation or hopelessness they often have known from BIRTH,,

will be more vulnerable to certain temptations and choices,,,

than those who are not born into that type of an emotionally handicapped environment,,,,

Children without fathers are 3x more likely to wind up in trouble with the law. It's a statistic. I learned it in 'Economics of Crime.'

another good point,, fatherlessness is another problem, especially mixed with an impoverished community,,,,

So, what does that say about the high rate of black-on-black murders in the USA? Does it not say that the murderers in such cases were nurtured in a bad way? And who nurtured them?

Oh, gee, do you suppose that the high rate of out-of-wedlock births in the USA might have something to do with children growing up without fathers?

I think it is little boys wanting to stick it in and not be responsible for what comes out, main problem imo.

it says their environment contributed to their view of the world and their sense of hope, which skewed their perception and their values

it says they were in the WORST type of environment to have the lack of parenting(mother father)that so many other well off children have as well, but not with the same outcome,,,,,


because of where we are as a group/caste we generally will be hit hardest and worst by symptoms that are not specifically isolated in our communities,,,,

kind of like how a dehydrated person may be affected more harshly by a shortage of water than persons who are not,,,

A 2 parent family is the best environment for kids, unless one is very violent.

Separatists will always argue their people are not responsible for their actions.

I agree the design works well when it is used properly

mother and father cherish each other and children respect mother and father,,

as often as bigots argue that 'race' is responsible for actions,,

The last time that I checked, it takes two to make a child. So, "little boys" aren't able to "stick it in" without female accomplices.

What bigots hates whitey and the jew?

Throughout the world there are children who grow up in poverty, and yet they become law-abiding adults because the adults in their life taught them to be law-abiding.

So, if you claim that murderers are murderers because they were nurtured to be violent, then you are claiming the adults who did the nurturing did something wrong, unless you don't think there is anything wrong with violence.