Following that reasoning they ought to ban fattening foods soap operas and thousands of other things people can abuse.

Hell's bells people get obsessed with all sorts of things that affect their ability to support themselves and conduct adult relationships....even religion.

Clinton huh! I will remember that one for another time. Kiddie porn..I will protect my kids to the death to keep something like that from happing to them and I will be in their lifes enough to know if it does. You watch it, get caught watching it, we will put you in with big bubba and make sure he knows you did.

I would like to give an example of why what society does and the message they send are often oppisite.

In a town not far away back say 6 years ago. A young man was the pride of the town. A honor student All state football player. Everybody loved him.

He get a full ride to play football at k-state. Everyone is excite for him. He is thier a few months and kansas drinking age is lower than Mo.

He goes to a night club living the college dream a football player popular what could go wrong right?

Well at this night club him and a friend meet a couple of girls and they invite them to thier house.

They go out the girls get in thier own car and they follow them to thier house.

A few days later they get arrested for statutory rape.

They admitt they had sex with them and said what do you mean they are 16 we met them in this night club.

Well in the trial the girls contradicted themselves and they presented evidence that the girls had fake ID's to get into the night club.

Should be case closed right? Those boys thought they did nothing wrong the girls even invited them to thier house. no thier parents house who were out of town.

Kansas being the understanding state they are gave each kid 5 years no parole in prison.

Thier lives ruined. when they had a bright future ahead of them.

Never mind how many laws these 2 teenage girls broke and how big of liars they were. The Prosecuter wanted to make sure he probally would get re-elected because he sends perverts from K-state to prison. did not affect him.\


Kinda like the Duke guys but thier parents were millionaires or they might of got 30 years in prison each.


Then we wonder what is wrong with society. Everyones way is right. Then we get laws that seem good maybe to a few because our media tells us they are. so of course we believe it.

now the one time town Heroe as it was. Is now on the internet as a rapists.

His future is down the drain..

can't find a job, or housing because anyone can refuse a sex offender.

What is wrong with this picture.

I know this must be a movie about a wayward science fiction movie I am watching.. no I just woke up

Its a tough world out there. Thats why I keep my kid well informed. Hey it did something right, shes in her 3rd of college and a dam fine young woman!!! Im still informing her yet latley she thinks shes informing me.

My goodness what was they suppose to do take finger prints 1st and run a criminal check on them

Everyone who opposes porn has a little moral horror story or two to tell about how awful it is. A bit like the don't masturbate or you will go blind story.

The facts are that in societies where porn even quite violent porn in some cases is available sex crimes are lower than here in the US.

I don't need the government or the church to be my parent. Please, get the facts and quit listening to fear.

Teach your children well. Leave me alone to read or watch what I would like.

A disclaimer, child pornographers does not enjoy my support. The makers of that crap should be shot.


from http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/online_artcls/pornography/prngrphy_rape_jp.html

The question of how or even if pornography is linked to rape or other sex crimes has been with different societies for many years. In the United States, it was shown that, as far as could be determined by a Commission appointed by U. S. President Lyndon B. Johnson (Pornography, 1970), no such relationship of pornography leading to rape or sexual assault could be demonstrated as applicable for adults or juveniles. Following the idea of the 1970 President's Commission, in 1986 the findings of the United States' Attorney General's Commission were released (Meese, 1986). Appointed in 1984 by President Ronald Reagan, this commission found, in contrast with the previous Presidential Commission, that: "substantial exposure to sexually violent materials . . . bears a causal relationship to antisocial acts of sexual violence." In distinction to the Presidential Commission, however, this Attorney General's Commission was politically, not scientifically, constituted. This Meese Commission was primarily composed of nonscientists who did no research of their own and commissioned none. It solicited testimony mainly from specific parties and organizations which it anticipated would be sympathetic to its goals while ignoring testimony from those it suspected would be disagreeable (Lynn, 1986; Nobile & Nadler, 1986; Lab, 1987). The Meese Commission's own minority report, by two of the only three women on the panel, --one of whom had a great deal of experience in sex research-- dissented from the majority report in saying the findings were not in keeping with the amassed social science data (Meese, 1986). Subsequent nation-wide studies in the United States also seemed to find no strong evidence that rape rates were associated with the availability of pornographic magazines (Baron and Straus, 1987) or adult theaters in a community (Scott and Schwalm, 1988; Winick & Evans, 1996).

So I guess these two young men got what they deserved then in your mind?

And sence when has porn not been available in this country?

now what happens to a stranger. oh well.

But lets not get someones rights to what a few believe should be. We need to protect thier right no matter what or how contrary it has been all through time.

I bet those families do not see it that way.

A horror story. I think I mentioned this before but not on this topics thread.

I wonder how many of you can name the girl who went missing and all the uproar thier was and speculation in Aruba a couple of years ago.

Do you remember her name?


Now lets go to a more recent definate tragedy in Oklahoma.

How many can remember the 2 little girls names that were killed execution style down the road from thier grandmothers house?




Now which one do you believed deserved more attention from our news media and which one got more?


The one where thier was speculation this could of been a sex crime?

Or the one where we know 2 children were murdered?


That should answer what drives what the media wants us to believe is more important.

My two cents here, but...

Porn has been around since the beginning of time! The problem with society today is that we use this and other things as excuses for bad behavior.
Bottom line is, if you don't like, don't watch it. If it doesn't float your boat, don't watch it! But, if you know right from wrong, you can watch it without raping or molesting somebody!

Do you work for Hollywood?

It does sound like exactly what Hollywood was saying when it was taken up with congress about sex seens on primetime TV.

Of course Hollywood won out and the reason was what you are saying.

they also said that behavior kids see on TV even in cartoons they know the difference between reality and make believe.


Now this could not of possibly have anything to do with a kid who finds his dads gun and shoots his friend.

Get up silly they do on TV.


No Porn could not influence society.

Of cource not that is why all of you want the Bible read everyday in school because you are sure it will not influence them.


I am glad you will support Bible clubs and the reciting of the 10 commandments and the pledge of allegience because you are absolutely sure it will not influence anyone.

I am right? Right

You have many parental controls you should be using. Tv has, Internet has, Your own control over what they see. Quit bringing wasington into my bedroon. They screw the pervert meeting up and never put the toilet seat up..Im a male..

Ok, first of all I live in Oklahoma, the center of the Bible belt. There was no Hollywood at the beginning of time. Using Hollywood to blame for the downfall of society is yet another excuse.

And, for your example of a kid finding a gun and shooting his friend, my dad was a policeman and a hunter and there was guns in our home at all time. We were taught from birth to respect and NOT TOUCH the guns. Blame the parents for not securing the gun! Blame the shooter for pointing the weapon! Stop making generalized excuses for bad behavior! Personal responsibility needs to come back in style!

As for the rest of your statement, I don't have a clue as to what you are talking about!

I am just saying what is around us and what we see and hear either has an influence on the population as a whole or it does not. which is it?

I certainly do support peoples rights to bible clubs ect. As long as they are not forcing it on me. I feel the same way about porn, which I find only slightly more offensive.

So Miles you want the government to control everything you see & hear?

I'm not trying to start a Sarah Palin fight, but I'm going to use her as an example. When she spoke, some people thought she sounded intelligent and some people thought she sounded stupid. It was an individual thing, not all or nothing. I'm just saying that we, as individuals need to start taking personal responsibility for our actions and stop blaming bad behavior on these generalized issues.

No I do not want that.

But I do not think the general public realizes they do exactly that now.

The News media is who tells us what to be upset about.

Incites us to rebel.

Right under our eyes and everyone will defend what we have for years now been told.

As for the gun thing you are right. The parent should protect his children from guns. That is just an example that I was trying to relay that we are influenced and our children, teenagers included.


This is what I hear in todays society.

We have the right to porn

We have the right to have our children and us to learn about man on man or women with women.

For just a couple of things.

But in the same breathe we do not want the bible or anything about it taught in our schools at all.

It is offensive. It teaches murder and puts women down and a moral code we do not like at all.

It has the audacity to tell us we sin. It is make believe.

Our children should not be exposed to such stuff teach it at home.


If it is mentioned it is pushing down your throat.

But then things that are offensive to people who believe the Bible is a code of conduct. If they find these other things offensive and these things being taught in school.

They really do not have the right to complain. they are slandered as biggots. Not loving. haters


when it is quite evident that societies outlook on these very things were acceptable until the advent of mass media.

You can look at what we believe as a whole to what we see on TV and the news. The internet also. But the internet we do have more choices.

The news and TV programming is propaganda.

I define propaganda as anything that has a large effect on a large amount of people.

Huh? What happened to the porn discussion. Sarah Palin? Does anyone want to tell what porn really does for them. I know for some folks, myself included, it is quite stimulating. For normal folks it could be used as a sexual "starter" so to speak. I can't speak for the freaks and mentally ill, but should we regulate all of society so we don't get some idiot or nut going off in the wrong direction (so to speak)?

so if porn was banned those two guys would not have taken those girls up on their offer of sex

only the naive or the ignorant would think that

they should not be in jail if the story is true

but i am sure the story is off in a few spots

it always is

like i said you want something to be banned move to a place where human rights are not so important

like afganistan or iran

you want us to take up a collection for you

You can come to the pervert meeting. Hell washington is already there and been a member for a long time.. Tap Tap

it does

and if you do not want to be around it the world is your oyster

(but those should be banned to huh)

move to a society that does not have such an open mind if you do not want to be around it

if you raise your child in the way they should go they will not stray far from it