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| Topic: Is the God of Israel the God of all? | |
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Is the God of Israel the God of all? Your sincere opinion please
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Edited by
bibarnes
on
Sun 10/13/13 06:47 AM
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The simple answer is, Yes He is. The complication comes when when you factor in the prophetic books of the Old Testament, especially Isaiah. The foretelling of the coming of the Messaiah was (and is) much anticipated by Israel. As a Christian I see that what Israel wanted is not what they got. They did not get a warrior of vengance to defeat all the enemies. Part of that problem was, in the words of the great philosopher Pogo, "We have met the enemy and it is us." The Messaiah came for all people. Jew and Gentile alike. He is a man of peace and grief, but most of all HOPE.
I have read here from some that they could not follow a God that was going to throw you into the pits of Hell for sinning. God doesn't do that, you do. I will use the analogy of the drowning man again. You are in the lake drowning and I throw a purple life preserver to you, you don't like purple, but purple is all I have. You reject the purple life saver and drown. Am I responsible for your rejection? No! I offered a way and you chose to ignore it at your own peril. In the New Testament Jesus quotes from Isaiah frequently. John tells us that God gave His only begotten Son to pay the price for our sin. The only payment God will accept is that of blood from a "spotless" lamb. The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is truly the God of all. Bill |
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Intelligent answer!
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The simple answer is, Yes He is. The complication comes when when you factor in the prophetic books of the Old Testament, especially Isaiah. The foretelling of the coming of the Messaiah was (and is) much anticipated by Israel. As a Christian I see that what Israel wanted is not what they got. They did not get a warrior of vengance to defeat all the enemies. Part of that problem was, in the words of the great philosopher Pogo, "We have met the enemy and it is us." The Messaiah came for all people. Jew and Gentile alike. He is a man of peace and grief, but most of all HOPE. I have read here from some that they could not follow a God that was going to throw you into the pits of Hell for sinning. God doesn't do that, you do. I will use the analogy of the drowning man again. You are in the lake drowning and I throw a purple life preserver to you, you don't like purple, but purple is all I have. You reject the purple life saver and drown. Am I responsible for your rejection? No! I offered a way and you chose to ignore it at your own peril. In the New Testament Jesus quotes from Isaiah frequently. John tells us that God gave His only begotten Son to pay the price for our sin. The only payment God will accept is that of blood from a "spotless" lamb. The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is truly the God of all. Bill Awesome illustration! 
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Edited by
1Expat
on
Wed 10/16/13 05:49 AM
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I believe not. Now I do believe in Christ, but not Jehovah. This is not a flippant comment full of spite or guile. It is a soul searched and considered statement. If you study how the letters by everyone in the bible came to be known as the collection we know of as "The Bible," you see that Constantine blended Judaism with the teachings of Christ. Now, I do believe that Jesus was sent by his father, a truly righteous and Holy God but he is not Jehovah. Jesus said he learned his ways from watching and learning from his father.
Now, consider this... Jesus taught basically, "Hey, if you want more than all of this earth stuff, follow me. No matter the cost." He didn't demand or threaten. Didn't strike bargains. He doesn't need you to fight, slay and take MATERIAL things i.e. land etc. like "the God of Abraham did. If God is love, he's not Jehovah. True love honors free will. THAT'S part of the reason Jesus is the Man of Sorrows. We bring our own judgment upon ourselves and we walk with willful ignorance by choice, yes? "Let the dead bury the dead." Now, I do believe that Jehovah/Yahweh/Enlil does exist, but as a "power or principality of the air." A great con and deception become dogma. Now if you approach the bible with these things in mind, a whole new picture emerges. Obviously, what Jesus did on the cross was massive. So massive that Christ's message was blended with a "the Bargaining God" of Abraham to obscure, co-opt and control the true message. There are several voices on the old Testament, sure. God the true father's voice does break in every now and then. The Bible, anthropologically and historically is also important. Leviticus, for example - great anthropologically/historically, but I'm pretty sure if I ripped it out of my Bible, only book lovers (like myself) would lament the loss of the script. Observing angels would just yawn. Holy Land? In a truly holy place, no evil can even come close to stepping near - and not because of human warriors, gates or walls. Just by the virtue of the fact that holiness actually is there. And that place is not Jerusalem OR Mecca. Holiness is away from the earth, as Jesus is showing us (even through the worm eaten scripture, his sheep hear his voice)how we must overcome ourselves to be made holy and enter in. A personal, individual transformation. Not a mass "Rapture." It's all about what's really going on in your heart in the midst of every interaction we have and NOT about religious observances. I could go on, and on as this is where I live in my head space most of the day. I'll spare you, bro. Lol. I am a Christian and truly do strive to be more like him (Jesus). You may be a little offended (not my intention) of what I had said....but over time, the seed has been there within those who truly are reaching, truly feel deep down inside that something is a bit "Off" when trying to fit the "accepted" concept of "God" into a box, scripture or "Official Doctrine." I think as we enter into hard times, these seeds will start to grow within us here and there. All men fall, few men reach. The Bible is full of such examples... |
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I believe not. Now I do believe in Christ, but not Jehovah. This is not a flippant comment full of spite or guile. It is a soul searched and considered statement. If you study how the letters by everyone in the bible came to be known as the collection we know of as "The Bible," you see that Constantine blended Judaism with the teachings of Christ. Now, I do believe that Jesus was sent by his father, a truly righteous and Holy God but he is not Jehovah. Jesus said he learned his ways from watching and learning from his father. Now, consider this... Jesus taught basically, "Hey, if you want more than all of this earth stuff, follow me. No matter the cost." He didn't demand or threaten. Didn't strike bargains. He doesn't need you to fight, slay and take MATERIAL things i.e. land etc. like "the God of Abraham did. If God is love, he's not Jehovah. True love honors free will. THAT'S part of the reason Jesus is the Man of Sorrows. We bring our own judgment upon ourselves and we walk with willful ignorance by choice, yes? "Let the dead bury the dead." Now, I do believe that Jehovah/Yahweh/Enlil does exist, but as a "power or principality of the air." A great con and deception become dogma. Now if you approach the bible with these things in mind, a whole new picture emerges. Obviously, what Jesus did on the cross was massive. So massive that Christ's message was blended with a "the Bargaining God" of Abraham to obscure, co-opt and control the true message. There are several voices on the old Testament, sure. God the true father's voice does break in every now and then. The Bible, anthropologically and historically is also important. Leviticus, for example - great anthropologically/historically, but I'm pretty sure if I ripped it out of my Bible, only book lovers (like myself) would lament the loss of the script. Observing angels would just yawn. Holy Land? In a truly holy place, no evil can even come close to stepping near - and not because of human warriors, gates or walls. Just by the virtue of the fact that holiness actually is there. And that place is not Jerusalem OR Mecca. Holiness is away from the earth, as Jesus is showing us (even through the worm eaten scripture, his sheep hear his voice)how we must overcome ourselves to be made holy and enter in. A personal, individual transformation. Not a mass "Rapture." It's all about what's really going on in your heart in the midst of every interaction we have and NOT about religious observances. I could go on, and on as this is where I live in my head space most of the day. I'll spare you, bro. Lol. I am a Christian and truly do strive to be more like him (Jesus). You may be a little offended (not my intention) of what I had said....but over time, the seed has been there within those who truly are reaching, truly feel deep down inside that something is a bit "Off" when trying to fit the "accepted" concept of "God" into a box, scripture or "Official Doctrine." I think as we enter into hard times, these seeds will start to grow within us here and there. All men fall, few men reach. The Bible is full of such examples... You need to study constantine and the council of Nicea and Trent. he did not blend judiasm with the faith.. He wanted judiasm gone and Zorastrrism in where Mithra was the Messiah and Magi was thier Priests, Dressed in Black and Red. an Edict was put out that Sunday would be the new Holy ay in the Roman Power and anyone caught keeping the sabbath was under penalty of death.. People had to flee for thier lives. all the feasts except for Penetecost was out lawed the Feast Commanded in Lev.23 will be forced to keep when Yahshua comes back or they will recieve no rain.. Zech 14. Constantine put a Death Warrant on Jewish ways. What was still being kept almost 300 years after the Messiah's death. Because of Constantines edicts we see in the dark ages soliers killing with out mercy in the name of JC with a large cross on thier uniform and thier swords were a cross.as did thier helmets have a cross between thier eyes. U can find this in any world book or whatever. rejecting j hovah you may of been blessed to as what hebrew names mean and Yahweh is the name nt j hova no one knows where the je comes fromm or what it means but thier is a meaning for hovah OT:3050 OT:1943 hovah (ho-vaw'); another form for OT:1942; ruin: KJV - mischief. (Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright � 1994, 2003 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.) |
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Edited by
1Expat
on
Thu 10/17/13 12:46 AM
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Illustration: Enter a murder scene under investigation. Something bad happened. Are the detectives arguing whether the firing pin that fired the lethal bullet struck the primer on the cartridge properly in the center or slightly askew? Nope. Now zoom back. The major concern here is the larger overarching question. Yes? Enter the teachings of Christ (mystic son of GOD) vs. Judeo Christianity (a contradiction in spirit). In regards to Constantine (a ruler, usually prodded about by one behind the scene counsel or another and typically garners either the applause or condemnation of history)- the overarching point is the the great deception of who the truly holy God is as well as what true righteousness IS. I don't want to get caught up in being a Pharisee or Sadducee as in the times of Christ. A clanging cymbal full of tangled spaghetti arguments and the intellectual equivalent of a body builder, oiled up, on the stage, flexing his butt off for the crowd. The point is, how do we live our internal life? God IS, regardless of childish human argument. Professing ourselves to be wise, we become fools. Agreed? What did Jesus teach us and what are we doing with it? Creating and accepting ironclad dogma or giving all - absolutely all - not for a stupid mansion in heaven or a get out of hell pass ... but just to see his face. Period. Period. Agreed? Besides, what is coming has not been written about. Where do we each truly stand within our hearts? You'll feel the tug of truth in you when you hear it. Not always comfortable. But you feel it. I used to quote scripture like crazy. But truly reaching is how a man breaches a wall. I've given my honest and sincere opinion on this matter. Not to stir anything up, but out of love of the pursuit of truth. Out of love for those few truly reaching with their utmost. Even a Judge will tell you, evidence is not "the truth." Take care guys. |
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so,you all mean to tell me that some mid-eastern tribal Deity is what keeping this Universe together?
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so,you all mean to tell me that some mid-eastern tribal Deity is what keeping this Universe together? |
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i will give you a guideline that s if you ar good christian open the book of john ch 10 v 10-14 you will get the answer,which say iam not a God bt iwas sent by God to the people of israil, so jesus is a massenger bt not a God,,
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Edited by
1Expat
on
Thu 10/17/13 03:16 PM
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Yep....but I don't believe Jehovah is his father.
The righteous father, the Alfa and Omega is. Jesus's father's ways vs. Jehovah's ways... obvious disconnect. "...for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you." (John 15:14-15) Jahova - “The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name.” (Exodus 15:3) It'll bother you for a while, but sooner or later, your heart, if you truly seek the truth will, say, "...Oh, my. Yes." Deprogram the dogma. Though, I must admit, Old Testament and pro-zionism apologetics are entertaining. Bible waving pharisees abound aplenty. i.e. John Hagee. (please note: there is a true distinction between being anti-Zionist vs anti-Semitic. Half truths and omission have done well to obscure the facts from the run of the mill sheeple) I think I've said all I have to say. It's obvious some don't read long post all the way through. LOL. Peace. |
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Short and simple, I believe there is only 1 God. And that we all essentially worship the same God in all religions. With all of the breaks from the churches, and reformations I don't believe any 1 group has it right. But we should still seek him. I truly believe that everyone has their own personal relationship with God and that is the reason it is called a "personal relationship".
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Is the God of Israel the God of all? Your sincere opinion please Yes! The God of Isreal is the God of all. |
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so,you all mean to tell me that some mid-eastern tribal Deity is what keeping this Universe together? lol... you people are funny... gravity put the planets in place, and DNA/genetics put the "countless" (they can count them, btw) veins in our bodies... any other questions? |
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Short and simple, I believe there is only 1 God. And that we all essentially worship the same God in all religions. With all of the breaks from the churches, and reformations I don't believe any 1 group has it right. But we should still seek him. I truly believe that everyone has their own personal relationship with God and that is the reason it is called a "personal relationship". The Almighty God is not a God to those that hate their fellow human being or their nabour. You persecute your nabour to join your religion? You kill those that are not serving same God you serve? Then the God that created the heaven and the earth is not your God because "He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love (1 John 4: 8)." |
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Edited by
Toks88
on
Sun 10/20/13 05:40 PM
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i will give you a guideline that s if you ar good christian open the book of john ch 10 v 10-14 you will get the answer,which say iam not a God bt iwas sent by God to the people of israil, so jesus is a massenger bt not a God,, Jesus Christ is not a messanger of God, John 10: 30.I and my Father are one. |
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i will give you a guideline that s if you ar good christian open the book of john ch 10 v 10-14 you will get the answer,which say iam not a God bt iwas sent by God to the people of israil, so jesus is a massenger bt not a God,, What version are you quoting from? John 10 v10 -14, addressesthefact that Jesus is one with God. "Jam the good shepherd, not a hired hand." SLIGHTLY condensed. If I knew how to cut and paste between apps on my kindle I would have done that. |
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so,you all mean to tell me that some mid-eastern tribal Deity is what keeping this Universe together? Is this the same one who needed tons of Gold and Silver? 
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I'm more modern and realistic in my concept of the prime source of all life.
I think its rather trivial to give it a name or a sex or a country. |
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A very BIG YES!!
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