And you hilly billy_s thought is was the Grand Canyon.

But it is a Grand Canyon....even if it is on Mars!!!!

Right. This now folks is the Arizona Dessert. As we can see, hoof marks, indicates Buffaloes who still roam free.

It sure is ....

What would become of Texas after they shale out the oil.
Another 100 years.

Urm, I don't think this planet will last that long. Are there any signs of condominiums on Mars?

The sand keeps getting in. Locating a wind shield here.
looks like the picture didn't travel back.



on second try, yes.

$74 million, to view the real estate from 2000Kms.
Maybe sending a mobile phone on a closer orbit would have worked better.

Refer Sassy's post on smart phones for earthquake monitoring - so why not?

I think the closest feel we could get about mars terrain; habitable that is;
is 'Ulluru', Australia. Sandstone rock, 348m above ground with 2.5kms of
its bulk, underground (not clear on the 'underground' significance but...)

But that's what night life on mars would be, a clear view of the milky way.
http://uluru-australia.com/ayers-rock-tours-experiences/stargazing-at-uluru/
Daytime, the rock heats up even with the boots on.

Interesting. We have much better cameras orbiting the Earth. Seems like we would send a high resolution satellite there too. I guess it is about money.

'Money', is just a red herring foisted after the sub-prime. The money siphoned out by Wall Street remains within the US; maybe in the hands of few individuals & corporates, but within the US banking system. The billions leant out to Fanny Mac & Mae: was printed money so nobody got really hurt (except public institutions like the universities & their research grants).

The real issue was the trillion siphoned out from the European banking system which remains undisclosed. This is what tipped the balance for Greece and the European economy; (Asian also). Under these circumstances, flaunting expensive space trips to the World would not be wise; so the ‘short of funds’ game.

Of course, all this is my belief, highlighting the economic and political games with research; but this does not wash out the real problem which is,
what would the astronauts do if and after they land on Mars, say within
the next decade or so. 250 million miles is no longer a distance.

Ok, so we all know that it takes another 2years of orbital time before Mars gets back to this 'closing distance' and that any landing would mean 2 years solitary plus the 6 months up down voyage time. That accentuates the problem.

Again, surviving two years is not that big a problem (except for frayed nerves) but for four factors:
1. radiation levels - astro-suits would wear out faster
2. colossal dust storms - wear out most equipment including robots
3. the near cryogenic temperatures of winter: - 63degC.
(Temperatures in Antarctica is -90degC, a shorter winter).


So many landings, orbitals, fly-bys... between -10 and 30 deg latitudes

Now if we take notes outside of NASA:
The European Space Agency, (includes the English who crashed their beagle in 2003), is planning to land robots in a future mission. The English seem to focus on craters - the volcanic variety: Olympus Mons: largest volcano, 22kms, (3 times higher than Everest), wider than England. Now, all of a sudden, English school boys have lessons on 'Dear Mars'.

The Russians have developed a modern launching facility. Now they are in discussions with the Chinese for joint missions. Personally, I don't think they are going to 'fumble' this race.

Indians, okay, we have our ISRO, and we are quite contended with launching orbital missions. We follow, where others lead but our costs are way down.

So there's a lot of effort going on but it does not solve the basic problem: what do we do on Mars; run another observatory? Tap the 'high pressure sub-terrain' water source?

4. And that brings us to the 4th problem: the energy source to sustain life. Solar plants may be feasible; with people on the ground cleaning or shielding it during the storms. I think Hollywood got it right in their film: Total Recall - Nuclear power plants. I suppose till this kind of technology, skid mounted nuclear power plants 'like those diesel generators', we would not have the beginnings of a real mission which may include some Terra-forming and other dreams.

So I do agree with Charles (present head of NASA) when he tells Congress that focus should remain on Mars and the technology requirements.

Meantime, there's this 'friendly' survey grid system:

Hmm..and all this time !..I thought.my ex had the largest canyon..

nobody got hurt... i know you live in another country, so i will tell you who got hurt the worst... the millions of people that lost their homes... and each home that was repossessed, was sold for pennies on the dollar to the same people that's siphoning wall street funds...

so fannie may and freedy mac made(from the democrats) billions to recoup there loses, millions still lost there homes, the rich bought all this land and homes and made more billions, fannie may and freddy mac gave bonuses to the higher ups in the company to show their hard work in making the people lose their homes, and this was all enacted by another democrat by the name of "slick willie" clinton and his butch wife...

Thanks MM,
Didn't know the brutal facts.
Since this i feel is vital knowledge could you please correct my math?

Say a home loan was provided to me (& i've a low credit rating).

Take a loan for 60k, down payment 5%: $3000
Now I'm committed for the next 20 years at $600 / month?

And I default after say 6 months (Wall St. or not, Home is repossessed anyway). I should have stayed with my $300 /month rental apartment in the first place.

So my losses are:
Down payment: $3000/-
& $300 x 6 = $1200 (since $300/pm would've been for rent anyway)
Total of $4,200

That's probably a year's saving's for low income group.
Hard, but not devastating?
An accountant's point of view, (keeping aside the family hardship).
---
My understanding was these high risk mortgages were bundled as securities
and sold to 'other' institutions: something Wall St. covered in smoke.
Now when the default's started coming in, S&L' would repossess?
---

Discussing Mar's pales if one doesn't get one's basic survival right.
So please do help.

A bank cannot increase interest charges if other's default on loans;
it's based on Fed's charges. & Fed's charges were low at that time?

i guess when you lose everything you own, your credit rating, probably your job too, all in less than a week, it's no big deal...

the worst thing is, that it all seems like a planned deal from the democrats...

only thing mars will ever be is a mining colony, nothing more...

Realize what you are saying.
Thanks for putting across kindly.

Regarding Mars, as it's you who got us interested in all this in the first place, you know very well it's a technology driver & an economy driver thereafter.

Then there's the ripple effect. In India, I've seen technology reduce red tape & corruption(?)

i've kinda come to the realization that space travel is heading in the wrong direction, but still not a bad thing... seems that most of it is turned into a get rich scheme to mine asteroids and other valuable objects around us...

isn't India a major player in the space exploration now?

As you know we are hedged in by China and Pakistan and all 3 of us don't trust each other. haha, what a life. So we have some defense technology in place and that's naturally grown to our space programs.

To be a strong player, one must be able to recover; like landing astronauts and recovering them back. We don't mind throwing objects out to space, European institutes hire our services to do that, launch their smaller experimentals and we release them like grapes into orbits. Once a while, there's some collaboration with NASA; like NASA telling us where our satellites are: 'cause it's blocking the view', stuff like that.

No I don't think we are in a hurry. We are waiting for you Americans to start that mining up there & then apply for them green cards. That way we know we are returning. So you guys hurry it up.

I must add that the Chinese Government has mellowed a bit but they have
a long standing agreement with Pak's army and as we know Pak's Government
listen's to their military. So another 100 years before there's any collaborative effort.

I see a unified collaborative effort at some point: this following NASA's entrepreneurship. That's if the other Nations are to achieve any meaningful success. If ISA can happen without a single nation taking all
credit - that's something. European Space seems to be working on these lines under UK leadership. Read about the Russian Mir & Chinese CSA getting their act together. Long term looks good.