Topic: Obamacare... affordable or not?
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Fri 05/16/14 10:09 PM

Big Increases in Obamacare Premiums and Deductibles Coming in November

mad

The rich keep getting richer... without really understanding the impact they're having on the general public who's tired of being taken advantage of as we constantly have to sacrifice and tighten our budgets doing without, while our elected officials are continuing to live high off the hog at tax payers expense.

:angry:

Something tells me when our ancestors came to America, fought and died in the wars so we all could be free and have a chance to earn and prosper, they never thought those in government would be living lavishly while the governed stood outside the gates looking in with their stomachs stuck to their ribs.

explode

Like I've said since before day one... this isn't going to end well... and any idiot can see this... so how is big money going to keep the angry masses under control when they've finally had enough of the inequality?

what


And there is justice in this world. From beating their chest and declaring what a great thing free insurance was going to be and now reality.

And then the surprise when it's not only not free but much more expensive that before except for the new Medicaid burden from those states expanding Medicaid, all paid with somebodies taxes.

And hey, is it just a coincidence that the raises are in November, right after the elections, how convenient. And how about those big bombs in 2015 not to mention the even bigger bombs in 2016 if there is a 2016.

Oh yeah, total destruction, thank god the UN is going to help out.

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Fri 05/16/14 10:13 PM

glad to see that somebody else knows what is going on out there!!!
America needs this joke of a President IMPEACHED SOON!!!



Why, so we can go from a partial idiot to a complete idiot, no good unless we impeach them both. But then are you ready for Boner? Just where do the people win?

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Fri 05/16/14 10:28 PM


glad to see that somebody else knows what is going on out there!!!
America needs this joke of a President IMPEACHED SOON!!!



An impeachment is not a removal from office.
Instead, it is a formal accusation of wrong-doing.


And that would not be correct. The Articles of Impeachment are the indictment handed down by the house. The Senate tries and if convicted by a two-thirds vote (not very likely) then he is impeached where the only judgement is removal from office. And then the fun starts.


Black's Law Dictionary, Revised 4th Edition, 1968
IMPEACHMENT. A criminal proceeding against a public officer, before a quasi political court, instituted by a written accusation called "articles of impeachment;" for example, a written accusation
by the house of representatives of the United States to the senate of the United States against an officer.

Articles of impeachment. The formal written allegation of the causes for an impeachment, answering the same purpose as an indictment in an
ordinary criminal proceeding.

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Fri 05/16/14 10:36 PM


If it was repealed, I suspect the replacement bill would include some of the provisions like existing conditions and maybe a provision for those who exceed lifetime limits to go onto medicare. It's anybody's guess but there would be something hopefully better than Obamacare ... which wouldn't be too hard.


hopefully something truly affordable and more freedom to choose plan levels..let the peeps are healthy not have to pay as much and kee pout HSAs

and enrollment optional so they will have to be competitive w/ their offerrings


Things will never become more affordable until you get profit out of medical and the revolving door between the medical companies, especially big pharma, are permanently closed.

A good example is cancer. Each cancer patient is worth $50,000 a year. Their goal is to keep the patient alive for 5 years or a total of $250,000. To cure the patient is not profitable. And most patients do not die from cancer, but the treatments. Radiation and Chemo kill the immune system first, total destruction.

But here is another interesting fact, 27% of people with cancer survive without ever having treatment. But that percentage drops to 2% with treatment.

There are thousands of articles and documentaries available on just YouTube alone and millions more using Google or Bing.

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Fri 05/16/14 10:39 PM

enrollment is already optional on the healthcare exchange,, we just have to have insurance from SOMEWHERE, but we don't have to get it on the exchange


Im just hoping there isn't an even more do nothing congress after OBAMA due to the obsessive focus on trying to destroy whats been put into place

things can always improve, and mere improvements would be welcome,,,,leaving everyone their own peace of historic achievement to boast about,,lol


Bull, pure bull. But may you be the recipient of all you have requested.

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Fri 05/16/14 10:59 PM
Edited by alnewman on Fri 05/16/14 11:09 PM

I don't mean "stuck with" in the sense that I regret it. Just a reassurance. It's good to have medical coverage, and even though Republicans cry crocodile tears over the uninsured, and any other negative they can find, those same Republicans have no plan to cover people who need it and couldn't otherwise afford it.

And when was this that you needed me? The ideas have been there. We have examples of other healthcare systems around the world. Other countries enjoy healthcare that costs a fraction of ours.

No, the problem is that Republicans in Congress have put partisan politics over the good of the country and hate the ACA only because it was done by Obama. Republicans so couldn't stand having a black president that they immediately pledged to defeat everything he wanted at every opportunity. Real Americans should try to work together to solve the problems.


Absolute hogwash, name just one country. Want to start with England? url=http://rt.com/news/uk-nhs-health-crisis-049/]UK healthcare on brink of collapse - NHS regulator

How about France? France's Health-Care System Is Going Broke

How about Japan? 75-year-old Japanese Man Dies After Hospitals Reject Him 36 Times

And the Swiss? Health Care Abroad: Switzerland. Well this seems about as good as it gets but it is free market and not for profit. But they are still experiencing rising cost with a total medical expenditure as percentage of GDP second only to the United States. Oh and all insurance policies in Switzerland are individual, no group plans just as it should be.

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Fri 05/16/14 11:06 PM



Oh no, Mortimer! your stuck with this ACA? And now you want republicans to come up with something real ideas? Where were you when we needed you?

I don't mean "stuck with" in the sense that I regret it. Just a reassurance. It's good to have medical coverage, and even though Republicans cry crocodile tears over the uninsured, and any other negative they can find, those same Republicans have no plan to cover people who need it and couldn't otherwise afford it.

And when was this that you needed me? The ideas have been there. We have examples of other healthcare systems around the world. Other countries enjoy healthcare that costs a fraction of ours.

No, the problem is that Republicans in Congress have put partisan politics over the good of the country and hate the ACA only because it was done by Obama. Republicans so couldn't stand having a black president that they immediately pledged to defeat everything he wanted at every opportunity. Real Americans should try to work together to solve the problems.

Still haven't smelled the Bitter Almonds yet,hmm?
Really think there wouldn't be some temporary System being put in place in case of a repeal?laugh slaphead


Smell bitter almonds, no, but I do enjoy my Bitter Apricot Seeds. Same chemical but different molecular structure. Doesn't seem to affect healthy cells but quite murderous on cancerous ones. I also eat apple and peach seeds, less effective but same results.

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Mon 05/19/14 06:11 AM
3 Obamacare Revelations That Might Astound (and Confound) You

www.fool.com/investing/general/2014/05/18/3-obamacare-revelations-that-might-astound-and-con.aspx

1. The S&P 500 could pocket an extra $700 billion.
2. Obamacare fans and foes were both right about premium increases.
3. Employees will pay more -- then less -- of health insurance premiums.

As if anything our government coffers do to spill over into the pockets of our elected officials really takes us by surprise anymore.

Mortman's photo
Mon 05/19/14 02:35 PM
Edited by Mortman on Mon 05/19/14 02:37 PM

Absolute hogwash, name just one country. Want to start with England? url=http://rt.com/news/uk-nhs-health-crisis-049/]UK healthcare on brink of collapse - NHS regulator

How about France? France's Health-Care System Is Going Broke

How about Japan? 75-year-old Japanese Man Dies After Hospitals Reject Him 36 Times

And the Swiss? Health Care Abroad: Switzerland. Well this seems about as good as it gets but it is free market and not for profit. But they are still experiencing rising cost with a total medical expenditure as percentage of GDP second only to the United States. Oh and all insurance policies in Switzerland are individual, no group plans just as it should be.

Just because those governments choose to underfund their healthcare systems doesn't mean that they're not cheaper than our system.
source: Washington Post "21 graphs that show America’s health-care prices are ludicrous"

Conrad_73's photo
Mon 05/19/14 02:52 PM


Absolute hogwash, name just one country. Want to start with England? url=http://rt.com/news/uk-nhs-health-crisis-049/]UK healthcare on brink of collapse - NHS regulator

How about France? France's Health-Care System Is Going Broke

How about Japan? 75-year-old Japanese Man Dies After Hospitals Reject Him 36 Times

And the Swiss? Health Care Abroad: Switzerland. Well this seems about as good as it gets but it is free market and not for profit. But they are still experiencing rising cost with a total medical expenditure as percentage of GDP second only to the United States. Oh and all insurance policies in Switzerland are individual, no group plans just as it should be.

Just because those governments choose to underfund their healthcare systems doesn't mean that they're not cheaper than our system.
source: Washington Post "21 graphs that show America’s health-care prices are ludicrous"

but it will miraculously get better once everyone's signed up on Obamacare?

TJN's photo
Mon 05/19/14 04:48 PM
Affordable to those who qualify for the subsidy. Not affordable to the country as a whole.

If you think healthcare run by the government is good just look at what is happening with the VA. Vets being put on fake waiting lists so the books look good meanwhile dozens are dying because care has been rationed.

Now just imagine the VA multiplied 90 times and you have obamacare.

Chazster's photo
Mon 05/19/14 08:32 PM

Affordable to those who qualify for the subsidy. Not affordable to the country as a whole.

If you think healthcare run by the government is good just look at what is happening with the VA. Vets being put on fake waiting lists so the books look good meanwhile dozens are dying because care has been rationed.

Now just imagine the VA multiplied 90 times and you have obamacare.


Just look at anything our government has run. It doesn't have a good track record.

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Wed 05/21/14 03:01 PM

3 Obamacare Revelations That Might Astound (and Confound) You

www.fool.com/investing/general/2014/05/18/3-obamacare-revelations-that-might-astound-and-con.aspx

1. The S&P 500 could pocket an extra $700 billion.
2. Obamacare fans and foes were both right about premium increases.
3. Employees will pay more -- then less -- of health insurance premiums.

As if anything our government coffers do to spill over into the pockets of our elected officials really takes us by surprise anymore.


This is but cherry picking the content based on what one wants to hear, not reality. This whole article if from Motley Fool, an investment adviser. But the whole thing can best be summed up by this comment in the comments segment:


Cutting employee health benefits does not eliminate the cost burden it merely shifts it from the company to the employee or the government, either way there will be a impact on the company bottom line that should not be under estimated!

So lets say company stops offering benefits and as result now saves $480 per employee, so now the employee has to go out and find himself insurance , if our employee wants a plan that is similar in deductibles and out of pocket costs than his employer plan he more than likely will have to pay $600-$900 per month , this because group policies especially for large groups come with big discounts on the premiums, but even if the employee opts for a plan with a higher deductible he/she will still pay more than before especially if the employer paid 100% of the premium before.

Now two things can happen, if our employee makes too much $ to qualify for subsidies the premiums will reduce the buying power and reduce discretionary spending this reduction will directly a variety of industries in the US causing a drop in revenue and as a result affecting the stock price!

The second possibility kicks in for employees who do qualify for subsidies, in this case the cost burden will be largely shifted to the government but the government has to get the money from somewhere so its either more debt or higher taxes both of which will have a affect on the stock market in the long run, lastly the mentioned reduction in buying power can still take place if the subsidies only cover part of the premiums and the new premiums are higher than what the employee paid in the past!

Then off course lets not forget the negative PR any large company will receive as a result from dumping their employees into the exchanges, this PR in turn also can cause a reduction in revenue

So as much as I respect S&P I don't think that they have thought this whole thing through in all aspects.


S&P may not have thought matters all the way through, but Motley Fool has:


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Nothing like following the money to get the big picture, except for fools grasping at straws looking for what isn't there.

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Wed 05/21/14 03:22 PM


Absolute hogwash, name just one country. Want to start with England? UK healthcare on brink of collapse - NHS regulator

How about France? France's Health-Care System Is Going Broke

How about Japan? 75-year-old Japanese Man Dies After Hospitals Reject Him 36 Times

And the Swiss? Health Care Abroad: Switzerland. Well this seems about as good as it gets but it is free market and not for profit. But they are still experiencing rising cost with a total medical expenditure as percentage of GDP second only to the United States. Oh and all insurance policies in Switzerland are individual, no group plans just as it should be.

Just because those governments choose to underfund their healthcare systems doesn't mean that they're not cheaper than our system.
source: Washington Post "21 graphs that show America’s health-care prices are ludicrous"


And just what does that have to do with it? Pretty obvious none of the articles were read, and that is only the tip of the iceberg.

And how are they going to pay for all this? More taxes, most countries are already on the brink of tax revolt.

No this is just more liberal illogical thinking that you can always rob more to pay for less. What a brainless concept that is accepted by the entitlement masses. Don't worry about it, someone else will pay.

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Wed 05/21/14 03:24 PM
Edited by alnewman on Wed 05/21/14 03:28 PM



Absolute hogwash, name just one country. Want to start with England? UK healthcare on brink of collapse - NHS regulator

How about France? France's Health-Care System Is Going Broke

How about Japan? 75-year-old Japanese Man Dies After Hospitals Reject Him 36 Times

And the Swiss? Health Care Abroad: Switzerland. Well this seems about as good as it gets but it is free market and not for profit. But they are still experiencing rising cost with a total medical expenditure as percentage of GDP second only to the United States. Oh and all insurance policies in Switzerland are individual, no group plans just as it should be.

Just because those governments choose to underfund their healthcare systems doesn't mean that they're not cheaper than our system.
source: Washington Post "21 graphs that show America’s health-care prices are ludicrous"

but it will miraculously get better once everyone's signed up on Obamacare?


Sure it will. We will get better and have a Swiss like system without the Swiss economy, all because our entitlement crowd wants it.

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Wed 05/21/14 03:27 PM


Affordable to those who qualify for the subsidy. Not affordable to the country as a whole.

If you think healthcare run by the government is good just look at what is happening with the VA. Vets being put on fake waiting lists so the books look good meanwhile dozens are dying because care has been rationed.

Now just imagine the VA multiplied 90 times and you have obamacare.


Just look at anything our government has run. It doesn't have a good track record.


Yeah, it should have the record of the track, the one used to run it out of the country.

Lpdon's photo
Sun 05/25/14 04:47 AM

Conrad_73's photo
Sun 05/25/14 07:25 AM

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Sun 05/25/14 11:24 AM




Love it!!!!!

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Fri 05/30/14 12:05 AM
Republicans' Suprising New Position On Obamacare

thinkprogress.org/election/2014/05/29/3442576/republicans-obamacare-mcconnell/