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Community > Posts By > mykesorrel
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Topic:
Rise of atheism.
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why should I expect any realistic book to leave out anything but whats easy or pleasant or nice? I think we should expect more from a so called divine being. Some of the things the Bible God does are NOT divine acts, I don't care how you wanna justify them. If one is gonna claim God is better than we are, then said God damn well better act the part, otherwise it's just a human made to be a God. more of the teenagerish, 1.you arent the way I THINK you should be, so you arent worthy,,,, 2.you dont make sense to 'me' because you dont behave as I think you should and I am pretty brilliant about how you should act,,, No it's called using my head. Simple as that. I don't blindly accept things anymore. I think, I reason, and my logic tells me a God like that is not love. Bottom line. personal logic is subjective,,,as is personal bottom line I dont blindly accept blind questioning or suspicion,,my logic tells me a God like that is JUST as well as loving,,, Well you have been lied to. You may take offense at that, but that is the truth. The Bible God is nothing more than a human. I respect that is what you believe. Hopefully you can respect that its NOT what I believe. Neither of us has proof one way or the other of such existence of a 'lie' or absence of one,,, I have more proof than you do. How can God be a God of love, yet of hate? How can He be all forgiving and all merciful, but then let you die anyway without a chance to repent again? These things are NOT logical! what you have meets the standards of 'proof' for YOU How can man love and hate, feel joy and pain? these arent proof of any lie about God, that he has such capability... since he created us in his image it would be expected that we might share some quailities(not all, but some) The only proof you have, is in your book, if there was any legitimate proof that these people existed, why is it not found anywhere else?? One source does not proof make. Second, let's talk about creation for a second. It makes NO sense that God would make us with the capacity to act as we do, fully knowing ahead of time no less that we'd act as we do, and then still punish us anyway. NONE. If it's true, then God messed up and made us imperfect, which would mean he isn't perfect. He can't be perfect and yet make us wrong. No, if He made us this way, we were meant to be this way flat out. This alone disproves what Christianity says about God in and of itself. There is no way in the world that can make any good sense at all. This is one example of how this 'debate' has no concrete way to 'convince' either side. first, it is stated that there is NO 'legitimate' biblical evidence outside the bible(untrue) and then it is stated that ONE source isnt proof. How far do most people take this philosophy in the modern world? Are you aware how many NEWS sources just repeat ONE story from ONE source? IF the initial source is considered valid enough, you will have dozens of other 'sources' paraphrasing and borrowing from it. That is how information gets spread plenty of time. In this case though, there are non biblical accounts from historians of the time which also make mention of events that happened in the bible and of Jesus. There is archaeology which also has uncovoered places and things mentioned in the bible. But I am sure the sources would not be 'legitimate' enough for anyone convinced that its all just stories and fairytales. Nothing worst then seeing a Deist (i'm assuming that's what Kleisto is) and a theists debating which representation of their God is truth. The whole point of personal belief, is just that, a personal belief, if whatever reason MH wants to believe what she so be it, just the same as Kleisto. The only problem comes when people on any side use there belief system and try to regulate it in the government, etc. For instance this whole prayer day in Texas, i can guarantee if Muslims wanted to hold a national Allah day, America would be a **** storm. As MH pointed out, i think it's a little redundant two people debating something of which both have no evidence for. the whole religion thread is usually about opinions for which people have no evidence for... just opinions and beliefs as for prayer day, anyone of any faith can 'pray', if its not a MANDATED observance, I really dont see the issue perhaps they should have called it 'national moment of reflection day', so it would be PC,, but that seems a bit long and unnecessary if the people of the state were cool with 'prayer day' Yes, it is wrong, once prayer and government is in the same sentence it is completely wrong. Now, if the Churches held a day of prayer in the Church so be it, as long as the government stay out of it i don't care what theists do. |
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Topic:
Rise of atheism.
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why should I expect any realistic book to leave out anything but whats easy or pleasant or nice? I think we should expect more from a so called divine being. Some of the things the Bible God does are NOT divine acts, I don't care how you wanna justify them. If one is gonna claim God is better than we are, then said God damn well better act the part, otherwise it's just a human made to be a God. more of the teenagerish, 1.you arent the way I THINK you should be, so you arent worthy,,,, 2.you dont make sense to 'me' because you dont behave as I think you should and I am pretty brilliant about how you should act,,, No it's called using my head. Simple as that. I don't blindly accept things anymore. I think, I reason, and my logic tells me a God like that is not love. Bottom line. personal logic is subjective,,,as is personal bottom line I dont blindly accept blind questioning or suspicion,,my logic tells me a God like that is JUST as well as loving,,, Well you have been lied to. You may take offense at that, but that is the truth. The Bible God is nothing more than a human. I respect that is what you believe. Hopefully you can respect that its NOT what I believe. Neither of us has proof one way or the other of such existence of a 'lie' or absence of one,,, I have more proof than you do. How can God be a God of love, yet of hate? How can He be all forgiving and all merciful, but then let you die anyway without a chance to repent again? These things are NOT logical! what you have meets the standards of 'proof' for YOU How can man love and hate, feel joy and pain? these arent proof of any lie about God, that he has such capability... since he created us in his image it would be expected that we might share some quailities(not all, but some) The only proof you have, is in your book, if there was any legitimate proof that these people existed, why is it not found anywhere else?? One source does not proof make. Second, let's talk about creation for a second. It makes NO sense that God would make us with the capacity to act as we do, fully knowing ahead of time no less that we'd act as we do, and then still punish us anyway. NONE. If it's true, then God messed up and made us imperfect, which would mean he isn't perfect. He can't be perfect and yet make us wrong. No, if He made us this way, we were meant to be this way flat out. This alone disproves what Christianity says about God in and of itself. There is no way in the world that can make any good sense at all. This is one example of how this 'debate' has no concrete way to 'convince' either side. first, it is stated that there is NO 'legitimate' biblical evidence outside the bible(untrue) and then it is stated that ONE source isnt proof. How far do most people take this philosophy in the modern world? Are you aware how many NEWS sources just repeat ONE story from ONE source? IF the initial source is considered valid enough, you will have dozens of other 'sources' paraphrasing and borrowing from it. That is how information gets spread plenty of time. In this case though, there are non biblical accounts from historians of the time which also make mention of events that happened in the bible and of Jesus. There is archaeology which also has uncovoered places and things mentioned in the bible. But I am sure the sources would not be 'legitimate' enough for anyone convinced that its all just stories and fairytales. Nothing worst then seeing a Deist (i'm assuming that's what Kleisto is) and a theists debating which representation of their God is truth. The whole point of personal belief, is just that, a personal belief, if whatever reason MH wants to believe what she so be it, just the same as Kleisto. The only problem comes when people on any side use there belief system and try to regulate it in the government, etc. For instance this whole prayer day in Texas, i can guarantee if Muslims wanted to hold a national Allah day, America would be a **** storm. As MH pointed out, i think it's a little redundant two people debating something of which both have no evidence for. |
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I was reading a religious site today and it made me realize a few things...so these are a few of the things I noticed while reading the posts from people .... First and foremost and not meant meanly, the best advantage to having a god or gods is you get to have at least one invisible friend all your life. You talk to them whenever you want to, sing about them, etc.... You are never alone When you are at an impasse in life, you have someone in which to get blind advice from all the time. They are never unavailable. Again you are never alone. Not the most important but pretty close, when you want to be right, you just say "god says it is right so it is right" and that is all. Brush your hands off and know you won. One of the most difficult to refute claims available. Your friend has your back. So these religious folks just never feel alone, stand alone in the world, have to face it alone, etc... There is an advantage to being religious, you are never alone. The Bible is a very deep book of how to live a good life. It is intended to stimulate your mind to do whats right without seeking anything in return. anyone who follows those simple guidelines of putting others 1st and blessing your enemy knows you get great self peace ( True Shalom). everyone has seen the miserable person who is only happy when someone else is not. but can we learn to understand what we really are or what we do? So Elohim gave us a book of scriptures that only 1 man has mastered everyone else its a continual self examination to free our hearts.. Blessings of Shalom..Miles   I have read the bible front to back and not just one kind of bible either. I used to collect them. But that has nothing to do with this thread at this time. The feeling of not being alone as an advantage of being religious is the topic if you have a view of that. That is my view of the topic. If you believe in Elohim that belief had to come from somewhere.not just from thin air could it? Blessings..Miles Would you agree it could come out of thin air? Considering man has conjured up thousands of superstitious worlds or beings. |
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women like to yell their invisible friends name instead of mine when i'm having sex with them  
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If I get there, I dont think I will need luck Talking more so the "Worshiping God for eternity" bit, hence someone ALWAYS being there.  Oh, I see in a paradise, constant company would be much less taxing, I wouldnt have the stress that leads me to need 'private' time in this mortal existence Touche. :) |
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If I get there, I dont think I will need luck Talking more so the "Worshiping God for eternity" bit, hence someone ALWAYS being there.
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never being alone could likewise be a bad thing I am the type of person who NEEDS plenty of alone time actually so IM not that motivated by the idea of someone being there all the time,,,, Good luck in heaven. 
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Topic:
If God existed?
Edited by
mykesorrel
on
Wed 07/20/11 04:15 PM
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lol ,,likewise listening to an atheist sometimes is like listening to a child whine about not getting things the way they wanted them,,,, or like listening to a teen who thinks they know everything and their parents make no sense (according to the teens vast knowledge).... lol  The first part was cute, the second bled with irony. "an atheist is completely fine not knowing why we're here, now, ask a theists this and it's always God did it". Show me a cloud or a burning bush that talks. ::cough:: Moses ::cough:: There is simply nothing to listen to other than the baloney that religious people spew. And that most certainly doesn't equate to the "voice of God". So then by that notion you have no reason to believe the people in Biblical days believed what they thought was God, interesting. explain to me first the relevance of what means of communication is being used to my opinion about people no longer listening or 'hearing According to your Bible God spoke to man, what don't you understand about that? many others havent made that decision and do hear, even if not from that 'burning bush' The relevance is NOT the burning bush, but the fact God spoke directly to man, i think it is laughable today people laugh at so called prophets yet believe 2000 year old stories is a truism. That's something i cannot fathom. |
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Topic:
If God existed?
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That's a totally incorrect analogy. To model the biblical situation it would need to be the parent who abandons the children, never speaks to them anymore, never answers their questions or anything. It would be the parent who started playing "Hide and Seek", not the children. To suggest otherwise is to perpetuate false religious "propaganda". The FACT is that no God audibly speaks to anyone from clouds today. That's the bottom line. So it would be this God who abandoned his children, not the other way around. Show me a cloud or a burning bush that talks. Otherwise, your claims that people aren't listening are false. There is simply nothing to listen to other than the baloney that religious people spew. And that most certainly doesn't equate to the "voice of God". This^ And to answer you question earlier i was talking about if the Abrahamic God existed, since that's what most people believe in Today. |
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Topic:
Google Plus
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Any thoughts? Think it will even put a dent in facebook Has anyone used it, and if so you like it? It's amazing, but they have a lot of work to do. It has potential, so long as Google push out features in a reasonable time. |
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Topic:
Rise of atheism.
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Atheism can mean lack of a god belief, which is different than saying there is absolutely no god....and Agnostic just means "do not know"..... so a person can be an atheist and agnostic. Just because a person does not know what the real truth is about god or no god, doesn't automatically default that Abrahamic Myths are true (like Jesus). And non-believers make up the third largest belief group in USA... Protestants 51%, Catholics 25%, non-believers 15% or more...... etc… You might think that some faith group must have grown during the last thirty years, and you’d be right: atheists and nonbelievers more than doubled in the eleven years between 1990 and 2001, from 14 million to 29 million: from 8% of the country to 14%. From 2000 to 2005, church attendance fell in all fifty states. This. |
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Topic:
If God existed?
Edited by
mykesorrel
on
Wed 07/20/11 03:39 PM
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This is something i always ponder. If God existed, would the world be a much different world, when i say this i mean a world govern by a deity. The Biblical worldview shows God interfering in already,to me, in my opinion i think this world would show miracles all the time and praying wouldn't feel like hoping to win the lotto. Any thoughts or opinions? As a parent, I disagree. I dont just 'give' my kids things all the time. They have to learn to be responsible and earn what they have. A Miracle is a 'gift', not something earned. I dont think God would just spread Gifts all the time or else they would no longer be considered 'gifts' but 'entitlements' "I don't think " is a matter of opinion. The God of the Bible intervened in human conditions every chance he got. then "disappeared" when man grew smarter. either it's a coincidence or ignorance on man's part to not accept the possibility they were led astray. I thought the thread was about 'opinions', I also think if God truly intervened 'every chance he got' we would have no will of our own but would be his puppets and he the puppetteer I also dont think God disappeared when man grew smarter, I think another 'option' (besides coincidence or ignorance to accept being led astray)is that man just started to think of himself more as his own God as he got smarter, in essence, closing his ears and mind to God more and more often,,, No, the basis of the topic is this world would be more Biblical if some kind of deity existed. you're going of human conditions and applying it to am omniscient deity. what I'm trying to bring up in this thread and what you so gracefully doing, is man using their own irrational mind to make rationality off something they are brought up to believe and "as a parent" you wouldn't have left your child alone to guess if you will be there or not. Funny you apply that parenting cicumstances in light of a God, but considering the flip of it is probably incomprehensible, because "God can do no wrong ". I think another 'option' (besides coincidence or ignorance to accept being led astray)is that man just started to think of himself more as his own God as he got smarter, in essence, closing his ears and mind to God more and more often,, This right here shows human ignorance to think that man has grown ignorance of accepting God. Why would a God move further away from it's creation, because its creation is getting smarter. Do you really even conclude that is rational? ahh, here we are with the standards ignorant, rational,,,etc,,, perhaps it is equally 'ignorant' to think that God is obligated to accept man Where does one infer that God has moved further away because people are no longer listening to him? If my children decide they are grown enough to live on their own, will their going to college where they are no longer under my tutelage constitute me , as a parent, 'moving further away' from them? I am in the same place I was, the same place they know how to reach ME God is as well, some have forgotten or dont care to know how to reach him,, so they blame HIM for their feelings of disconnect Oh my gosh i want to bang my head on my keyboard, lol. this is something i seriously came to realize being an atheist: "People will mold God to their own liking and have to come to their conclusions on your own." The God of the Bible was ALWAYS there from book cover to book end. Just like the Gods of Greece, Rome, Aztec etc and then human observations occurred and they "disappeared". The problem with you, is you're making so many excuses, that not once are you even considering the possibility, only "God don't owe you nothing, meh" retort. If my children decide they are grown enough to live on their own, will their going to college where they are no longer under my tutelage constitute me , as a parent, 'moving further away' from them? Really, are you even considering this? God is never there from birth to death, tell any child who father wasn't there and they would say "**** him", unless of course he was dead. The problem with people who have faith, is faith in a conclusion without evidence, but you believe so inherently that you refuse to believe otherwise and that's what scares people. You thinking of absolutism is no different the people of Islam who believe what they do now will grant them virgins in the afterlife and regard it a truism. I respect theists, but the ones like Colbert who can make light of what they believe in, without making excuses for it's errors, but you're fine to believe what you want. Listening to a theist sometimes is like listening to a used car sales man make every excuse to sell you some BS. 
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Topic:
If God existed?
Edited by
mykesorrel
on
Wed 07/20/11 03:24 PM
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This is something i always ponder. If God existed, would the world be a much different world, when i say this i mean a world govern by a deity. The Biblical worldview shows God interfering in already,to me, in my opinion i think this world would show miracles all the time and praying wouldn't feel like hoping to win the lotto. Any thoughts or opinions? As a parent, I disagree. I dont just 'give' my kids things all the time. They have to learn to be responsible and earn what they have. A Miracle is a 'gift', not something earned. I dont think God would just spread Gifts all the time or else they would no longer be considered 'gifts' but 'entitlements' "I don't think " is a matter of opinion. The God of the Bible intervened in human conditions every chance he got. then "disappeared" when man grew smarter. either it's a coincidence or ignorance on man's part to not accept the possibility they were led astray. I thought the thread was about 'opinions', I also think if God truly intervened 'every chance he got' we would have no will of our own but would be his puppets and he the puppetteer I also dont think God disappeared when man grew smarter, I think another 'option' (besides coincidence or ignorance to accept being led astray)is that man just started to think of himself more as his own God as he got smarter, in essence, closing his ears and mind to God more and more often,,, I was looking more so, the reason why i believe he would be there is because the Bible says.... The basis of the topic is this world would be more Biblical if some kind of deity existed. you're going of human conditions and applying it to am omniscient deity. what I'm trying to bring up in this thread and what you so gracefully doing, is man using their own irrational mind to make rationality off something they are brought up to believe and "as a parent" you wouldn't have left your child alone to guess if you will be there or not. Funny you apply that parenting cicumstances in light of a God, but considering the flip of it is probably incomprehensible, because "God can do no wrong ". I think another 'option' (besides coincidence or ignorance to accept being led astray)is that man just started to think of himself more as his own God as he got smarter, in essence, closing his ears and mind to God more and more often,, This right here shows human ignorance to think that man has grown arrogant of accepting God. Let's use supposed facts in your world view: Fact (going by Bible): God created man and even then governed everything he did. God killed millions to help his chose people or because the world was evil. God talked to man, so to say man cannot hear God in your world view is false ( i hear inane opinions that we wouldn't be able to comprehend God "awesome" voice). ETC Why would a God move further away from it's creation, because its creation is getting smarter. Do you really even conclude that is rational? |
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Topic:
If God existed?
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 <--------HEY WAKE UP. If I do your will cease to exist. You're apart of my dream. :-) |
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Topic:
Android love
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Pls wake-up Never! I'm dreaming, you are apart of my dream, and i shall never unplug from the system! 
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Topic:
Consciousness
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I know this topic was probably brought up before, but what are your views on it. Do you believe the consciousness is a mere set of memories we retain for our lifetime until our brain dies or something much more?
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Topic:
Rise of atheism.
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"head cannot justify something no matter how hard [you] try, it simply *cannot* be true." Cannot is an absolutism, this is why i disagree. then you disagree with, as i do, the person whom I WAS QUOTING. no worries but it's people like him not people like me i think you disagree with. Cool, apologies and thanks for clarifying. I was like "i hope this wise fellow is not suggestion what i think he is", then i read it again like "oops, maybe not".
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Topic:
If God existed?
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This is something i always ponder. If God existed, would the world be a much different world, when i say this i mean a world govern by a deity. The Biblical worldview shows God interfering in already,to me, in my opinion i think this world would show miracles all the time and praying wouldn't feel like hoping to win the lotto. Any thoughts or opinions? pondering the 'if god existed, would the world be a much different world' question makes about as much sense as answering the question with 'but god does exist.' now, pondering if the world would be a much different world 'IF RELIGIOUS DOGMA' did NOT exist' on the other hand? now there's something worth not only talking about but working toward. I concur, but anyone can imagine a biblical oriented world. It's quite fascinating to ponder such worlds. |
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Topic:
Rise of atheism.
Edited by
mykesorrel
on
Wed 07/20/11 03:14 AM
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How do I know? Simple, I USE MY HEAD. If my head cannot justify something no matter how hard I try, it simply cannot be true. That's about the easiest way to put it. Logically speaking things in religion simply don't add up. I'm not gonna try to make them add up if I can't. hey, you may be just the person i've been looking to talk to. you see, i've had a new hobby since i retired which involves the study of quantum mechanics. now i'm convinced that there must be something to this new science discipline but as hard as I USE MY HEAD, i cannot seem to grasp much understanding of the crap. and yet, unlike you, although i can't work it all out in my head, i still think that the science is JUSTIFIED. i find what my austrailian mate, a university professor teaching this science to phd undergrads, is telling me must make some sense and think the science is JUSTIFIED as it is leading us, or i should say folks in the profession like him, to a greater understanding of the universe. he says things like, "trust me, john. for now just grasp what i say about the basic principles as being correct. you'll understand why as we go along, but for now if you cannot accept these basic principles you'll never grasp quantum phyics." i listen to him because i think there is something to this stuff even though i cannot yet understand it. much of it at any rate. point being, i'd put my ability to "USE MY HEAD" up against your's, his or anybody else's on the planet. don't know your thinking on quantum physics but whether or not you've studied the discipline maybe you can help me out here. you say that if your "head cannot justify something no matter how hard [you] try, it simply cannot be true." well i want to KNOW stuff like you KNOW stuff. is there any TRUTH to this quantum stuff? if YOU cannot justify the crap in YOUR HEAD no matter how hard you've tried, "it simply cannot be true" right? i should find a new hobby, right? or if you have made use of your head and have justified it perhaps you'll sit in with me and my phd mate from austrailia next time we're online together and help the poor sucker out getting through my thick skull. actually he says the crap will likely never be fully KNOWN so perhaps you might help him out too. i'm sure he dosn't like chasing his tail in life and would appreciate KNOWING that if YOU can't figure it out in YOUR head "it simply cannot be true" and he can quit wasting his time and retire and go fishing like me. yes, i do have other hobbies that are not unlike chasing my tail. What people like you fail to realize is that quantum mechanics is testable in a lab not sure who's post you're referring to but people like me realized damn well that quantum mechanics is testable in a lab. Point being is, that people often say "you can grasp knowledge of x, y, and z so God must exist or how do you know God doesn't exist?" isn't the same as "i know this exists and here is the evidence", whether you(when i say you i mean any person for that matter) want to reject that evidence or not is up to you, very similar to God(s) of that gaps argument. I'm not even suggesting that's what you're implying, but it seems like that of what you might be implying in a way. It is up to no one to say "ha! I KNOW god doesn't exist", it's up to the person proclaiming it to show evidence, as I'm sure you already know. If that's not what you was implying, i apologize for assuming. And as i take it you have took an interest in science, i'm pretty sure you understand its beauty, maybe I'm reading what you wrote differently (maybe you can elaborate more). As you can see i disagreed with this quote: "head cannot justify something no matter how hard [you] try, it simply *cannot* be true." Cannot is an absolutism, this is why i disagree. actually, NOTHING has to become a freakin' debate. of course EVERYTHING can be debated and some folks here choose to debate religion. that is okay, right? right? please tell me i'm right. And you're absolutely right. :) |
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Topic:
Android love
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was wondering if I was the only person who have a love for Android in these forums, especially rooting ( I'm addicted to roms).
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