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| Topic: How Do YOU feel about violent men or women? | |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Thu 04/30/15 11:30 PM
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abuse: physical maltreatment so an abuser is one who uses physical maltreatment,, there is no mandate that they do it forever or never stop everyone can change You have no clue what you are debating this time, harmony. odd, since the definition is straight from websters and I have personally lived through just the type of 'change' that the op asked about |
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abuse: physical maltreatment so an abuser is one who uses physical maltreatment,, there is no mandate that they do it forever or never stop everyone can change You have no clue what you are debating this time, harmony. odd, since the definition is straight from websters and I have personally lived through just the type of 'change' that the op asked about Gonna put off all the mental, emotional, and verbal abuses too? Tell me, how many broken bones, busted lips and black eyes have you had in that ONE little disagreement? |
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Simply, not my nature. People who do stupid things, have criminal conviction records. That's a pretty wild assumption Really? If, by a 'certain' age, one is an abuser, it would be indicative, that they've been an abuser for a long long time. Somewhere in their history, will be records of reports against them, and possibly arrest records, even if there were no convictions for abuse . Even if there had been records or reports which are not easily available, without a conviction, this person will not be known to be an abuser. And it would be likely that he continues to fool other victims which eventually may become so serious, but may then be too late, cos' a life becomes at stake. Records of such magnitude, in the u.s., are a matter of public record. Actually, not hard to find at all. If, one chooses to look. If..... is a really really big IF! Which woman would look up such records/reports unless that ugly head started rearing from the very beginning of their relationship????? And where do you look if the said person were new, or if it were sealed, and not easily available if from different states/counties? Tell me, Rock....... would you know where to check whether I have a record? And would you check if I have not prior to this caused you to suspect that I even had a record? Dr. Jeckyll and Mr. Hyde. Others see abuser as a good partner and parent; behind closed doors, abuser is angry and aggressive. I think this answers my question! If I knew your name and approximate age, yes, I could find out, if you had a record. |
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abuse: physical maltreatment so an abuser is one who uses physical maltreatment,, there is no mandate that they do it forever or never stop everyone can change You have no clue what you are debating this time, harmony. odd, since the definition is straight from websters and I have personally lived through just the type of 'change' that the op asked about Gonna put off all the mental, emotional, and verbal abuses too? Tell me, how many broken bones, busted lips and black eyes have you had in that ONE little disagreement? the thread was pretty specifically about VIOLENCE the use of physical force to harm someone does abuse only count if bones are broken? I had one busted lip and two black eyes,, whatever significance that has,,,, |
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as i said, the human response is fight or flight and we ask men to reprogram that natural response to interrupt it in order to consider the gender of the assailant,, great if they do,, but they are no monster if they dont,, "but they are no monster if they dont,," Sounds like you condone that....... this is so so flawed! |
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as i said, the human response is fight or flight and we ask men to reprogram that natural response to interrupt it in order to consider the gender of the assailant,, great if they do,, but they are no monster if they dont,, "but they are no monster if they dont,," Sounds like you condone that....... this is so so flawed! really? so if i said liars arent monsters,, does that mean I 'condone' lying? interesting logic |
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abuse: physical maltreatment so an abuser is one who uses physical maltreatment,, there is no mandate that they do it forever or never stop everyone can change You have no clue what you are debating this time, harmony. odd, since the definition is straight from websters and I have personally lived through just the type of 'change' that the op asked about Gonna put off all the mental, emotional, and verbal abuses too? Tell me, how many broken bones, busted lips and black eyes have you had in that ONE little disagreement? the thread was pretty specifically about VIOLENCE the use of physical force to harm someone does abuse only count if bones are broken? I had one busted lip and two black eyes,, whatever significance that has,,,, From that ONE disagreement? And you kissed and made up? Obviously, he is not in your life anymore. I guess it was not the kind of change that could be suppressed and most likely came out in other ways after your supposed miracle counseling. Abusers do not change. |
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I was a boxer and a soccer hooligan in my teens. I have seen plenty of violence when I was growing up in Glasgow, both to me and I dished�it out to guys also. I've did MMA ( cage fighting ) too, but one thing I've never done is raise my hand to a woman and i never would. What I would love though is a few of the cowards that I've read about here, in a boxing ring, with me and see how they fare against someone that would hit them back! Any guy who hits a woman, ain't a man, he's scum and a coward!! I disagree wholeheartedly, there are few absolutes my first husband was far from a coward, he knocked out plenty of men, he had no problem being hit back I learned that as an adult, female or not, that I Shouldnt either dont put your hands on others and they have no reason to hit back but if you do, no right to complain if they do as i said, the human response is fight or flight and we ask men to reprogram that natural response to interrupt it in order to consider the gender of the assailant,, great if they do,, but they are no monster if they dont,, imho |
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abuse: physical maltreatment so an abuser is one who uses physical maltreatment,, there is no mandate that they do it forever or never stop everyone can change You have no clue what you are debating this time, harmony. odd, since the definition is straight from websters and I have personally lived through just the type of 'change' that the op asked about Gonna put off all the mental, emotional, and verbal abuses too? Tell me, how many broken bones, busted lips and black eyes have you had in that ONE little disagreement? the thread was pretty specifically about VIOLENCE the use of physical force to harm someone does abuse only count if bones are broken? I had one busted lip and two black eyes,, whatever significance that has,,,, From that ONE disagreement? And you kissed and made up? Obviously, he is not in your life anymore. I guess it was not the kind of change that could be suppressed and most likely came out in other ways after your supposed miracle counseling. Abusers do not change. no humans do not change, they will always have flaws,, those flaws arent 'abuse' coming out in different ways we seperated for reasons that were about trust, not violence or abuse on any level |
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Abusive people rarely change enough to risk my personal sanity/safety; and the sanity/safety of my kids always trumped whatever nice thing they might do that I could do for myself. Is it easy being a single Mom and listen to people trash talk about how you shoulda done this or that so the partner get another crack at maybe killing you or your kids? No but I figure "Fool me once; shame on you. Fool me twice; shame on me." When you put your head up and move forward in life it does get easier to attract a better caliber of partner because you become a better caliber of partner.
That whole balogne about second chances is for games where people who blow off your rights and your self respect are manipulating you to think they deserve what they threw away. That is just stinking thinking and excuses. |
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Edited by
tealbreeze
on
Thu 04/30/15 11:43 PM
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abuse: physical maltreatment so an abuser is one who uses physical maltreatment,, there is no mandate that they do it forever or never stop everyone can change You have no clue what you are debating this time, harmony. odd, since the definition is straight from websters and I have personally lived through just the type of 'change' that the op asked about Gonna put off all the mental, emotional, and verbal abuses too? Tell me, how many broken bones, busted lips and black eyes have you had in that ONE little disagreement? the thread was pretty specifically about VIOLENCE the use of physical force to harm someone does abuse only count if bones are broken? I had one busted lip and two black eyes,, whatever significance that has,,,, From that ONE disagreement? And you kissed and made up? Obviously, he is not in your life anymore. I guess it was not the kind of change that could be suppressed and most likely came out in other ways after your supposed miracle counseling. Abusers do not change. no humans do not change, they will always have flaws,, those flaws arent 'abuse' coming out in different ways we seperated for reasons that were about trust, not violence or abuse on any level lol, trust could be construed as mental, emotional, and verbal. Lessons learned for me. Never, ever trust an abuser again. No second chances. |
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Violence includes but is not limited to physical abuse... The gas lighting mentioned is much much worse... It causes the victim to be in conflict with themselves, and the doubt that ensues further empowers the abuser, since the victim is now in doubt if there was abuse taking place to begin with. That is most likely the reason that abusers are not reported or criminally convicted, to begin with. The longer and more elaborate the information becomes twisted by the manipulator, the more difficult it is for the victim to report such incidences. In the end, the manipulator moves on to the next target, without so much as a slap on the wrist. In the end, it is about the maintaining control while controlling someone else. The first to lose control -- usually the victim, ends up being looked down on, laughed at, mocked, ignored, or even identified as the person with the problem. While the abuser just watches and is entertained by everything unfolding, and only has to keep appearances and pretend to be something that they are not. Those who are equally entertained by such a vile disregard of and atrocities against human dignity and worth, are no less guilty of such crimes of violence...even when they are not charged or convicted by a court of law, and regardless their position in society. This is the essence of all abuse. |
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I was a boxer and a soccer hooligan in my teens. I have seen plenty of violence when I was growing up in Glasgow, both to me and I dished�it out to guys also. I've did MMA ( cage fighting ) too, but one thing I've never done is raise my hand to a woman and i never would. What I would love though is a few of the cowards that I've read about here, in a boxing ring, with me and see how they fare against someone that would hit them back! Any guy who hits a woman, ain't a man, he's scum and a coward!! I disagree wholeheartedly, there are few absolutes my first husband was far from a coward, he knocked out plenty of men, he had no problem being hit back I learned that as an adult, female or not, that I Shouldnt either dont put your hands on others and they have no reason to hit back but if you do, no right to complain if they do as i said, the human response is fight or flight and we ask men to reprogram that natural response to interrupt it in order to consider the gender of the assailant,, great if they do,, but they are no monster if they dont,, imho humans are diverse and quick to make every similar situation into the SAME situation ignoring details I believe all people can change, This was not a habitual or constant thing over the years we were together but an ISOLATED incident, but todays cliches would put my ex in the same detested category as all men that have ever laid hands on a woman the details matter, if someone is beat up on a 'regular basis' its unlikely that assailant will change without something else changing him,, and that starts with LEAVING but doesnt require staying gone under some assumption that they are irreperably terrible and unable to grow or change some are just terribly abusive and some are terribly damaged themselves, there are a range of DETAILS that make one situation different from the next I do look, which is why I married someone who I loved and loved me, and why when we both snapped that evening, I cared enough to take space and give him space so we could both really explore what was happening in our relationship and WORK towards making it better but today, people dont equate relationships with work, and such a notion seems unreasonable to them when just leaving FOREVER and villifying is so much easier |
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as i said, the human response is fight or flight and we ask men to reprogram that natural response to interrupt it in order to consider the gender of the assailant,, great if they do,, but they are no monster if they dont,, "but they are no monster if they dont,," Sounds like you condone that....... this is so so flawed! really? so if i said liars arent monsters,, does that mean I 'condone' lying? interesting logic We are not talking about liars here...... we are talking about men beating women who are smaller in size/weaker and not able to defend themselves. So, is it ok if the men can't control themselves and hit the women back in retaliation, and then injure her to the extent of requiring medical attention??? Yeah.... sock it to the woman because she smacked his arm, or poked his head? |
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Abusive people rarely change enough to risk my personal sanity/safety; and the sanity/safety of my kids always trumped whatever nice thing they might do that I could do for myself. Is it easy being a single Mom and listen to people trash talk about how you shoulda done this or that so the partner get another crack at maybe killing you or your kids? No but I figure "Fool me once; shame on you. Fool me twice; shame on me." When you put your head up and move forward in life it does get easier to attract a better caliber of partner because you become a better caliber of partner. That whole balogne about second chances is for games where people who blow off your rights and your self respect are manipulating you to think they deserve what they threw away. That is just stinking thinking and excuses. or forgiveness and allowance for human mistakes and growth,,,,which I dont think is stinking at all |
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abuse: physical maltreatment so an abuser is one who uses physical maltreatment,, there is no mandate that they do it forever or never stop everyone can change You have no clue what you are debating this time, harmony. odd, since the definition is straight from websters and I have personally lived through just the type of 'change' that the op asked about Gonna put off all the mental, emotional, and verbal abuses too? Tell me, how many broken bones, busted lips and black eyes have you had in that ONE little disagreement? the thread was pretty specifically about VIOLENCE the use of physical force to harm someone does abuse only count if bones are broken? I had one busted lip and two black eyes,, whatever significance that has,,,, From that ONE disagreement? And you kissed and made up? Obviously, he is not in your life anymore. I guess it was not the kind of change that could be suppressed and most likely came out in other ways after your supposed miracle counseling. Abusers do not change. no humans do not change, they will always have flaws,, those flaws arent 'abuse' coming out in different ways we seperated for reasons that were about trust, not violence or abuse on any level lol, trust could be construed as mental, emotional, and verbal. Lessons learned for me. Never, ever trust an abuser again. No second chances. whatever works for you forgiveness works for me,,, |
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Edited by
tealbreeze
on
Thu 04/30/15 11:54 PM
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I was a boxer and a soccer hooligan in my teens. I have seen plenty of violence when I was growing up in Glasgow, both to me and I dished�it out to guys also. I've did MMA ( cage fighting ) too, but one thing I've never done is raise my hand to a woman and i never would. What I would love though is a few of the cowards that I've read about here, in a boxing ring, with me and see how they fare against someone that would hit them back! Any guy who hits a woman, ain't a man, he's scum and a coward!! I disagree wholeheartedly, there are few absolutes my first husband was far from a coward, he knocked out plenty of men, he had no problem being hit back I learned that as an adult, female or not, that I Shouldnt either dont put your hands on others and they have no reason to hit back but if you do, no right to complain if they do as i said, the human response is fight or flight and we ask men to reprogram that natural response to interrupt it in order to consider the gender of the assailant,, great if they do,, but they are no monster if they dont,, imho humans are diverse and quick to make every similar situation into the SAME situation ignoring details I believe all people can change, This was not a habitual or constant thing over the years we were together but an ISOLATED incident, but todays cliches would put my ex in the same detested category as all men that have ever laid hands on a woman the details matter, if someone is beat up on a 'regular basis' its unlikely that assailant will change without something else changing him,, and that starts with LEAVING but doesnt require staying gone under some assumption that they are irreperably terrible and unable to grow or change some are just terribly abusive and some are terribly damaged themselves, there are a range of DETAILS that make one situation different from the next I do look, which is why I married someone who I loved and loved me, and why when we both snapped that evening, I cared enough to take space and give him space so we could both really explore what was happening in our relationship and WORK towards making it better but today, people dont equate relationships with work, and such a notion seems unreasonable to them when just leaving FOREVER and villifying is so much easier Even Police officers have regulations when approaching the mentally unstable. I believe in Karma. Not forgetting. Not forgiving is fine with me too as long as my abusers continue to give me space. I have a life. Not them it is not my concern. Why is your concern for abusers? WTF? |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Thu 04/30/15 11:55 PM
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mental instability is something that can be a part of but isnt the equivalent of violence
my concern is for human beings, and that they not be pigeonholed for their whole life for where they may have been at one moment or during one period of that life |
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Champion for abusers. I will remember this debate. sheesh.
Good freaking night. |
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lol
not into the label,,and not a champion just a human who allows for the flaws of other humans and the capacity for all humans to grow and change,, or else what is the point of living |
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