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| Topic: PELOSI: Buy a $15,000 Policy or Go to Jail | |
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Wow the more I read how people think in the US the more I am happy here in my Igloo with my free (not perfect) medical care . Yup, Canada is pretty cool place....nicest people too!  One good thing I noticed about Canada is that they don't allow FOX News. What you are seeing here in many of these posts Alzeimer is the Last Gasps of our failed Conservative party. 
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I wonder if, the folks sent to jail will be charged with a misdemeanor or felony. If it's a felony conviction, they lose the right to vote or own a firearm. But then they will have health insurance paid by the taxpayers. YAY!  So really, it's a win, win situation! LOL hellkitten,, nice. Here is part of the OP.. The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain “acceptable health insurance coverage” and who choose not to pay the bill’s new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income), are subject to numerous civil and criminal penalties, including criminal fines of up to $250,000 and imprisonment of up to five years seems like nothing new, these are the same consequences for anyone refusing to pay their taxes....nothing new under the sun really. As for car insurance being an opt out plan,,how many people dont have cars in america. We cant opt out of health but I dont know that the bill doesnt have something in place to make sure people can get it regardless of finances so that they should never have to worry about a fine. |
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The speaker of the house is fighting for the American people. i have insurance, but it's pretty bare-bones. i can't afford otherwise. if i have to choose between feeding my family and having insurance...i'm putting food on my table. go ahead, throw me in jail. maybe she can support my kiddos then. hey...finally we have a smart non-selfish thingking person talking...wish most ppl in US think like u...btw..maybe we can put ugly old pelosi in jail so she can be a ***** 2 someone in jail 
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Edited by
voileazur
on
Sat 11/07/09 11:40 AM
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PELOSI: Buy a $15,000 Policy or Go to Jail JCT Confirms Failure to Comply with Democrats’ Mandate Can Lead to 5 Years in Jail Friday, November 06, 2009 Today, Ranking Member of the House Ways and Means Committee Dave Camp (R-MI) released a letter from the non-partisan Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) confirming that the failure to comply with the individual mandate to buy health insurance contained in the Pelosi health care bill (H.R. 3962, as amended) could land people in jail. The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain “acceptable health insurance coverage” and who choose not to pay the bill’s new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income), are subject to numerous civil and criminal penalties, including criminal fines of up to $250,000 and imprisonment of up to five years. In response to the JCT letter, Camp said: “This is the ultimate example of the Democrats’ command-and-control style of governing – buy what we tell you or go to jail. It is outrageous and it should be stopped immediately.” Key excerpts from the JCT letter appear below: “H.R. 3962 provides that an individual (or a husband and wife in the case of a joint return) who does not, at any time during the taxable year, maintain acceptable health insurance coverage for himself or herself and each of his or her qualifying children is subject to an additional tax.” [page 1] - - - - - - - - - - “If the government determines that the taxpayer’s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply…” [page 2] - - - - - - - - - - “Criminal penalties Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses. Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual: • Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year. • Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3] When confronted with this same issue during its consideration of a similar individual mandate tax, the Senate Finance Committee worked on a bipartisan basis to include language in its bill that shielded Americans from civil and criminal penalties. The Pelosi bill, however, contains no similar language protecting American citizens from civil and criminal tax penalties that could include a $250,000 fine and five years in jail. “The Senate Finance Committee had the good sense to eliminate the extreme penalty of incarceration. Speaker Pelosi’s decision to leave in the jail time provision is a threat to every family who cannot afford the $15,000 premium her plan creates. Fortunately, Republicans have an alternative that will lower health insurance costs without raising taxes or cutting Medicare,” said Camp. According to the Congressional Budget Office the lowest cost family non-group plan under the Speaker’s bill would cost $15,000 in 2016. ### http://republicans.waysandmeans.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=153583 Way too many sensationalist inaccuracies, erroneous associations and leading arguments to deserve investing in a direct reply. You provided a link to the most dogmatic and propagandish '... Committee on Ways & Means Republicans...' website, when the only factual references, which help clarify all the confusion of this post, are stated black and white in a reply letter from 'Douglas W. Elmendorfis', Director of the Congressional Budget Office, to questions presented by Charles B. Rangel, of the Committee on Ways and Means. Here is the link to the actual source document: http://republicans.waysandmeans.house.gov/webreturn/?url=http://cbo.gov/ftpdocs/106xx/doc10691/hr3962SubsidiesRangelLtr.pdf To those whom prefer using facts rather than outlandish proaganda to form their opinions, simply read the letter of the above link, string the facts together, and like I, you will most likely come out of it with a completely opposite understanding than that of the highly biased propaganda of the 'Committee on Ways and Means', and carried over (IMO) by raiderfan. While there is room for a serious and responsible debate to take place on the question of the health care reform proposition from the current administration, grossly unfounded and erroneous propaganda will never help forward such a debate. |
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Edited by
raiderfan_32
on
Sat 11/07/09 12:15 PM
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PELOSI: Buy a $15,000 Policy or Go to Jail JCT Confirms Failure to Comply with Democrats’ Mandate Can Lead to 5 Years in Jail Friday, November 06, 2009 Today, Ranking Member of the House Ways and Means Committee Dave Camp (R-MI) released a letter from the non-partisan Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) confirming that the failure to comply with the individual mandate to buy health insurance contained in the Pelosi health care bill (H.R. 3962, as amended) could land people in jail. The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain “acceptable health insurance coverage” and who choose not to pay the bill’s new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income), are subject to numerous civil and criminal penalties, including criminal fines of up to $250,000 and imprisonment of up to five years. In response to the JCT letter, Camp said: “This is the ultimate example of the Democrats’ command-and-control style of governing – buy what we tell you or go to jail. It is outrageous and it should be stopped immediately.” Key excerpts from the JCT letter appear below: “H.R. 3962 provides that an individual (or a husband and wife in the case of a joint return) who does not, at any time during the taxable year, maintain acceptable health insurance coverage for himself or herself and each of his or her qualifying children is subject to an additional tax.” [page 1] - - - - - - - - - - “If the government determines that the taxpayer’s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply…” [page 2] - - - - - - - - - - “Criminal penalties Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses. Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual: • Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year. • Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3] When confronted with this same issue during its consideration of a similar individual mandate tax, the Senate Finance Committee worked on a bipartisan basis to include language in its bill that shielded Americans from civil and criminal penalties. The Pelosi bill, however, contains no similar language protecting American citizens from civil and criminal tax penalties that could include a $250,000 fine and five years in jail. “The Senate Finance Committee had the good sense to eliminate the extreme penalty of incarceration. Speaker Pelosi’s decision to leave in the jail time provision is a threat to every family who cannot afford the $15,000 premium her plan creates. Fortunately, Republicans have an alternative that will lower health insurance costs without raising taxes or cutting Medicare,” said Camp. According to the Congressional Budget Office the lowest cost family non-group plan under the Speaker’s bill would cost $15,000 in 2016. ### http://republicans.waysandmeans.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=153583 Way too many sensationalist inaccuracies, erroneous associations and leading arguments to deserve investing in a direct reply. You provided a link to the most dogmatic and propagandish '... Committee on Ways & Means Republicans...' website, when the only factual references, which help clarify all the confusion of this post, are stated black and white in a reply letter from 'Douglas W. Elmendorfis', Director of the Congressional Budget Office, to questions presented by Charles B. Rangel, of the Committee on Ways and Means. Here is the link to the actual source document: http://republicans.waysandmeans.house.gov/webreturn/?url=http://cbo.gov/ftpdocs/106xx/doc10691/hr3962SubsidiesRangelLtr.pdf To those whom prefer using facts rather than outlandish proaganda to form their opinions, simply read the letter of the above link, string the facts together, and like I, you will most likely come out of it with a completely opposite understanding than that of the highly biased propaganda of the 'Committee on Ways and Means', and carried over (IMO) by raiderfan. While there is room for a serious and responsible debate to take place on the question of the health care reform proposition from the current administration, grossly unfounded and erroneous propaganda will never help forward such a debate. you impune my reference then give the exact same one? what exactly is sensationalised and propagandised? the fact that the House bill will place a mandate to carry "approved" coverage? that failure to carry such coverage places a further income tax burden on the citizen? that such a tax burden, or rather failure to pay it, can result in jail time and 6 figure fines? what exactly are you refering to? The fact that they're now mandating as much as a 20% additional mandate on incomes in "Premium + Cost Sharing".. on a highly graduated scale? $50K and you're out of subsidy.. $50K isn't that great an income.. that's barely above what a new college graduate can expect coming out of school.. and subsidizing at a rate of 97% the lowest income earners... Please show me how this isn't direct redistriution.. from each acc'd to his means, to each acc'd to his needs.. I just don't get how this is justified under the Constitution.. |
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Edited by
raiderfan_32
on
Sat 11/07/09 12:53 PM
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So under HB 3962, the law will mandate how 15% of incomes over $50,100 are to be spent, that's if you're single.
If you're married and have a combined income over $102,100, this new law will mandate how 20% of your income is spent.. so for every hour you work, the government OWNS the first 9 to 12 minutes.. just to pay for healthcare.. that's in addition to the already mandatory Federal Income Tax which can be as much as another 20% off the top.. with the highest published tax rate at 35%.. So this law is going to make a claim on as much as 40-55%% of your fiscal year.. that's before you pay state and local taxes.. property taxes, gasoline taxes, school taxes, and every other tax you can imagine.. which means that every hour you work, now the government OWNS the first 24 to 33 minutes.. before you begin to pay all the other taxes you see in your local life.. So you you may have to work until the middle of May or June to start putting money in your pocket after the federals are done looting your wallet.. Meanwhile the least productive get their healthcare subsidised at a rate of 96 or 97%.. go ahead.. look at the table http://cbo.gov/ftpdocs/106xx/doc10691/hr3962SubsidiesRangelLtr.pdf |
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So under HB 3962, the law will mandate how 15% of incomes over $50,100 are to be spent, that's if you're single. If you're married and have a combined income over $102,100, this new law will mandate how 20% of your income is spent.. so for every hour you work, the government OWNS the first 9 to 12 minutes.. just to pay for healthcare.. that's in addition to the already mandatory Federal Income Tax which can be as much as another 20% off the top.. with the highest published tax rate at 35%.. So this law is going to make a claim on as much as 40-55%% of your fiscal year.. that's before you pay state and local taxes.. property taxes, gasoline taxes, school taxes, and every other tax you can imagine.. which means that every hour you work, now the government OWNS the first 24 to 33 minutes.. before you begin to pay all the other taxes you see in your local life.. So you you may have to work until the middle of May or June to start putting money in your pocket after the federals are done looting your wallet.. Meanwhile the least productive get their healthcare subsidised at a rate of 96 or 97%.. go ahead.. look at the table http://cbo.gov/ftpdocs/106xx/doc10691/hr3962SubsidiesRangelLtr.pdf mirror.. I'll save you the trouble  sounds good to me!!
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But if you're in jail you get free medical care right?! Might be worth going to jail! Jail is just a temporary stop to prison. If not having insurance is a a felony and you are sent to prison, three strikes and you are in for life. And I'll say again, you're still getting free medical care, right? As compared to those of us who fight to not get sick, because we can't afford to pay for not having insurance anyways... |
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So under HB 3962, the law will mandate how 15% of incomes over $50,100 are to be spent, that's if you're single. If you're married and have a combined income over $102,100, this new law will mandate how 20% of your income is spent.. so for every hour you work, the government OWNS the first 9 to 12 minutes.. just to pay for healthcare.. that's in addition to the already mandatory Federal Income Tax which can be as much as another 20% off the top.. with the highest published tax rate at 35%.. So this law is going to make a claim on as much as 40-55%% of your fiscal year.. that's before you pay state and local taxes.. property taxes, gasoline taxes, school taxes, and every other tax you can imagine.. which means that every hour you work, now the government OWNS the first 24 to 33 minutes.. before you begin to pay all the other taxes you see in your local life.. So you you may have to work until the middle of May or June to start putting money in your pocket after the federals are done looting your wallet.. Meanwhile the least productive get their healthcare subsidised at a rate of 96 or 97%.. go ahead.. look at the table http://cbo.gov/ftpdocs/106xx/doc10691/hr3962SubsidiesRangelLtr.pdf mirror.. I'll save you the trouble sounds good to me!! This is just absolutely insane. People also amaze me, willing to let the government force others to get into a government program. Why not say, oh well the heck with you then? No, this socialistic bill is just that, a socialist bill. How some either cannot see it or just don't care the the government is FORCING this upon some is going overboard and just causing more problems with the American people and the government. Some scream less government but hell, this bill is the biggest government control I have ever seen. I hope the senate is smarter than the house. 
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Ummm... didn't it say something like "...or pay a tax equal to 2.5% of your income"?
So if you are too poor to afford health insurance, let say you make $10,000 a year, then you have to pay $250, a year, right? What does this have to do with a $15,000 policy? Seriously, what am I missing here? |
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Once again Peledac has spoken so eloquently and is right on. As for myself, I've worked hard all my life, spouse died, my job offers no insurance so I will be going to jail{sounds restful}. But, Pelosi won't have my tax dollars from employment, house & sales anymore. How is this going to work?
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Once again Peledac has spoken so eloquently and is right on. As for myself, I've worked hard all my life, spouse died, my job offers no insurance so I will be going to jail{sounds restful}. But, Pelosi won't have my tax dollars from employment, house & sales anymore. How is this going to work? Well it sounds to me like you will only be going to jail if you refuse to pay a 2.5% tax on your income. And the tax on our incomes is already scaled to reduce the tax burden on those who can least afford it. |
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Wow the more I read how people think in the US the more I am happy here in my Igloo with my free (not perfect) medical care . That is what a lot of the people from other countries have been saying when they read what the conservative Americans are saying
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Wow the more I read how people think in the US the more I am happy here in my Igloo with my free (not perfect) medical care . Yup, Canada is pretty cool place....nicest people too! One good thing I noticed about Canada is that they don't allow FOX News. What you are seeing here in many of these posts Alzeimer is the Last Gasps of our failed Conservative party. exactly. I just dont believe anything the opposition says anymore no matter what.After all the crazy stuff I have seen that side say for all these years and then be wrong time after time after time,they got no credibility with me whatsoever
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Once again Peledac has spoken so eloquently and is right on. As for myself, I've worked hard all my life, spouse died, my job offers no insurance so I will be going to jail{sounds restful}. But, Pelosi won't have my tax dollars from employment, house & sales anymore. How is this going to work? Thank you!!! Some just don't see what is really going on, it's scary. Hey if you ever are threatened with jail over this, by all means let me know, I will hound their butts like they have never been hounded. The squeaky wheel gets oiled first and I will be that squeaky wheel. My ex cancelled my insurance, I'm a single mom, are they gonna throw me and jail leaving my daughter without a mother? Ha, I'd like to see how far that would go, the people I know won't keep their mouths shut that's for sure. They will open up pandoras box the first person that they try to put in jail. It will have a negative ripple effect that they never have anticipated. |
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Once again Peledac has spoken so eloquently and is right on. As for myself, I've worked hard all my life, spouse died, my job offers no insurance so I will be going to jail{sounds restful}. But, Pelosi won't have my tax dollars from employment, house & sales anymore. How is this going to work? Well it sounds to me like you will only be going to jail if you refuse to pay a 2.5% tax on your income. And the tax on our incomes is already scaled to reduce the tax burden on those who can least afford it. that 2.5% tax is money i could be spending to stay healthy or feed my children. |
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Once again Peledac has spoken so eloquently and is right on. As for myself, I've worked hard all my life, spouse died, my job offers no insurance so I will be going to jail{sounds restful}. But, Pelosi won't have my tax dollars from employment, house & sales anymore. How is this going to work? Well it sounds to me like you will only be going to jail if you refuse to pay a 2.5% tax on your income. And the tax on our incomes is already scaled to reduce the tax burden on those who can least afford it. that 2.5% tax is money i could be spending to stay healthy or feed my children. That 2.5% tax is there for when yuo FAIL to remain healthy, or your KIDS fail to remain healthy and you HAVE to go into the hospital, whether or not you want to, or die because you are so sick. I do not care who you are, what you do, how healthy you live, you WILL get seriously ill at one point or another, or yuor children will, it is a part of life. And for those who can not afford to pay 15k per year, or even 2500 per year, which is what I would have had to pay while working full time at walmart for insurance just for myself, at minumum wage, 2.5% is a hell of a lot more ffordable and reasonable than going with no insurance at all. Right now, I take home just over 600 a month. Tell me how I am supposed to pay your AVERAGE insurance premium as it stands right now. Not possible! |
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Once again Peledac has spoken so eloquently and is right on. As for myself, I've worked hard all my life, spouse died, my job offers no insurance so I will be going to jail{sounds restful}. But, Pelosi won't have my tax dollars from employment, house & sales anymore. How is this going to work? Well it sounds to me like you will only be going to jail if you refuse to pay a 2.5% tax on your income. And the tax on our incomes is already scaled to reduce the tax burden on those who can least afford it. that 2.5% tax is money i could be spending to stay healthy or feed my children. That 2.5% tax is there for when yuo FAIL to remain healthy, or your KIDS fail to remain healthy and you HAVE to go into the hospital, whether or not you want to, or die because you are so sick. I do not care who you are, what you do, how healthy you live, you WILL get seriously ill at one point or another, or yuor children will, it is a part of life. And for those who can not afford to pay 15k per year, or even 2500 per year, which is what I would have had to pay while working full time at walmart for insurance just for myself, at minumum wage, 2.5% is a hell of a lot more ffordable and reasonable than going with no insurance at all. Right now, I take home just over 600 a month. Tell me how I am supposed to pay your AVERAGE insurance premium as it stands right now. Not possible! |
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Right now, I take home just over 600 a month. Tell me how I am supposed to pay your AVERAGE insurance premium as it stands right now. Not possible! I don't see how, on only $600.00 a month anyone can afford to be on a free dating site.  Lulu quote. i work full-time for walmart, and i have insurance for quite a bit cheaper than that. in fact, they give me more money than i put in on it...i do have a high deductible, but who cares? You're right. No politician cares if you are healthy, employed or are homeless. All they care about is how much special interests pay them and there are many who will support their acts. |
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I wonder if, the folks sent to jail will be charged with a misdemeanor or felony. If it's a felony conviction, they lose the right to vote or own a firearm. i suspect since it's a federal law they'll be violating it's a felony. yay!!! this is EXACTLY what we need! more convicted felons among the american population. i hardly believe it, but whatever. sounds like a bunch of propaganda to me. but if it's real, this is sooooo awesome!! u wonder why the republicans didn't think something like this up. think about... the poor people can't pay, they become felons because they can't pay and NOW they can't vote so who's left to oppose the rule of the american aristocracy? it's BRILLIANT!! bwahahhahahahahahaahahahahahahahaa |
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