I never said anything about being classy. I say what I mean and mean what I say. Shut up troll.

No it doesn't. Big_Jim believes in the philosophies of The Official Church of Satan that was founded by Anton LaVey even though he is not an official member of the church. LaVeyan Satanists are basically athiests. They do not believe in a diety called Satan. Satan to them is an ideal.... ideals which Big_Jim tried to clue you in on earlier in this thread... which you obviously didn't bother to read.

Now if we were talking about Luciferian Satanists then you would be right. Luciferian Satanists believe in a real diety called Satan and they worship Satan as their God.

As for me, I'm not a Satanist, LaVeyan or Luciferian... however I do agree with some of Anton LaVey's philosophies. But I do NOT worship any Diety named Satan.

You are nothing more than a troll. I suggest that anyone reading this just ignore this woman, 2much4u. Do NOT feed the trolls.

How about if I take my broom & shove it up your a$$...

I want to ask you something... do you believe that Big_Jim worships Satan just because he calls himself a Satanist? Do you believe I worship Satan just because I practice witchcraft even though I worship the Holy Trinity which I see as Father God, Mother Goddess (the Holy Spirit), and their son Jesus the annointed one? What to you is a Satanists EXACTLY? Give me details... what to you is a Satanist?

The titheing was what I was referring to. It seems to be burned into every Christians brain to make sure they tithe. Some churches more than others push the titheing issue more. But I don't think I've come across financial greed within any church as you have. I'm sorry you've had to witness such things. I hope that one day you will find a church that you can call your home church.

LMFO!! Forget it! Nevermind! LMFAO! You are too much!

I really would like to see a church that isn't asking for money.

I asked you to clarify... in fact this is what I said... "You are quoting the Wiccan Rede, Lily, which by it's very title (Rede) means advice and counsel. The Wiccan Rede is advice not Holy Law. The Wiccan Rede also is for Wiccans... not all Pagans and Witches. Besides, I thought you said you don't claim yourself as a Wiccan? And what do you mean no such thing? No such thing as what exactly?" See I asked you to clarify... "no such thing as what exactly... you went off on a b!tching tangent on what your religion/spiritual path was... I figured you were evading my request for clarification. And I thought I'd make the point that you did indeed state that you were not a Wiccan because you are making it an issue to state The Wiccan Rede as though all Pagans and Witches abide by it. It was a legitimate observation.

No more caffeine for you. Now let me make myself clear. I get irked beyond belief when do-gooder Pagans put down people like Michelle Belanger or any other Vampire or Left Hand Pather especially when they spout off The Wiccan Rede and/or the Three Fold Law. You know I really hate TV shows like "Charmed" and Movies like "The Craft" because silly little teeny boppers tend to think they are "how to's" to Wicca. However, there is a quote from the movie "The Craft" that I can't help but Quote "True magic is neither black nor white. It's both because nature is both, loving and cruel, all at the same time. The only good or bad is in the heart of the witch. Life gives a balance of it's own." I hate having to quote from that stupid movie but that quote sums it up well. All I can add to that is this... there is both good and evil within all of us. The key is to keep a balance between the two within us. Tip the balance too far either way and the spirit becomes unhealthy. And yes, I believe that one can be too good, because one would be denying what is naturally there the natural evil within. One needs to let the evil out every now and then. Life has a way of balancing it all out. Now to get back to Vampirism... Vampirism works exactly like Reiki, only in reverse. Someone has an overabundance of Chi(Prana) and another is in need of Chi(Prana). When the one who has an overabundance of Chi is willing the one who is in need of the Chi will take (drain/feed) the Chi from the other. That is Vampirism. No one is getting harmed. Now, I'm going to lay off the caffeine myself.

Ok so the truth comes out. You had a horrible experience with Paganism as a child and ever since all Paganism to you is considered "satanic" and "of the devil." Well, guess what? I've had some pretty horrible experiences with Christians, Christian churches, and Christianity in general from the time I was a child into my adult life... and you know what? I did the whole thing of lumping all Christians into one basket so to speak for me to hate.... it gets really old after a while. Pretty soon a really great Christian pops their head up every once and a while and makes you rethink why you're hating all Christians. One day you will be asking yourself "Is it worth lumping all Pagans into one basket? Is it worth hating all of them just because a few treated me horribly?" One day you will get there my dear.

You are quoting the Wiccan Rede, Lily, which by it's very title (Rede) means advice and counsel. The Wiccan Rede is advice not Holy Law. The Wiccan Rede also is for Wiccans... not all Pagans and Witches. Besides, I thought you said you don't claim yourself as a Wiccan? And what do you mean no such thing? No such thing as what exactly?

No one is born a Witch no more than a person is born a chef. It is a path that one chooses. Now from time to time you might hear of the term "hereditary witch" being used by certain people. That term simply means a person was taught "the craft" by a close relative or gaurdian. Even though they have been taught the craft it doesn't make them a Witch. Kind of like reading the a cook book doesn't make one a chef. One has to dedicate their mind and spirit to the craft to be considered a Witch.

The practice of healing that you speak of is called Reiki. Mikao Usui developed Reiki in the mid 19th century Japan. Those who practice Reiki use a technique similar to the "laying on of hands." Practioners of Reiki will channel the life force within, which they call Chi or Prana, into a "healing energy" to the one who needs the healing. A Reiki practioner can treat themselves with this same healing process if needed. Many Reiki practitioners also undertake to observe the 5 Reiki Principles recommended by Mikao Usui which are as follows...

I - Just for today, I will not be angry.
Anger at others or oneself or at the whole world, creates serious blockages in one's energy. It is the most complex inner enemy.

Reiki is an excellent tool to remove anger blockages which have accumulated in the body over years, but it cannot remove the residue of current anger which occurs daily.

Letting go of anger. brings Piece into the Mind.

II - Just for today, I will not worry.
While anger deals with past and present events, worry deals with future ones. Although worry is not always a negative phenomena, endless worries may fill one's head, and each one bores a small hole in one's body and soul. While anger requires a focused Reiki treatment to remove obstacles, worry requires the energy to be spread throughout the entire body.

Letting go of worry, brings healing into the Body.

III - Just for today, I will be grateful.
Be grateful from your hart inward. Inner intention is the important element in this principle. Simple things as thanks, forgiveness, smile, good words, gratitude can improve others life and make them happy.

Being thankful brings Joy into the Spirit.

IV - Just for today, I will do my work honestly.
Support yourself and your family respectably, without harming others. Earn a respectable living, live a life of honor.

Working Honestly brings Abundance into the Soul.


V- Just for today, I will be kind to every living thing.

Honor your parents, honor your teachers, honor your elders.

Being Kind brings Love into the Will.


I hope this has been helpful to you, Abra.

I would like to share with you, GeminiGoddess, an article about the "Ambidexterous Path" a.k.a. "The Path of Unified Duality." The article was written by author Michelle Belanger who is also a key figure in the Vampire and Gothic communities. Some of the books she has written are "Psychic Vampire Codex: A Manual of Magick and Energy Work", "The Psychic Energy Codex: A Manual For Developing Your Subtle Senses", and "Vampires in Their Own Words: An Anthology of Vampire Voices."

In perceived ethics and personal approach, practitioners of magick seem to fall into one of two paths: the Left Hand Path or the Right Hand Path. The two paths are often seen as being diametrically opposed to one another, and further, the Left Hand Path is generally associated with "black" magick whereas the Right Hand Path is generally associated with "white" magick The following short article explores the real meaning of these two approaches and posits the existence of a third, more unified approach.

The Left Hand Path affirms that each individual can be a god and that magick is worked by exerting the Will on the outside world. In the magick of the LHP, the practitioner does not supplicate divinities or powers outside of him- or herself. Rather, the practitioner acknowledges that he himself holds all the power he needs to change himself and the world around him. "My Will be done," is the anthem of the Left Hand Path, and these staunch individualists worship no power save the power of their Self.

The practitioners of the Right Hand Path generally accept that each person contains a spark of the Divine, but where the mortal individual is concerned, there are powers greater still. Gods and goddesses exist on a level far superior to humanity, and it is through their power and their will that magick is enacted. Thus, in the RHP, the practitioner declares, "Thy Will be done," supplicating the powers that be in order to achieve change within and without. When a working is complete, the individual expresses gratitude for the assistance lent to him or her by the deities who were the real power behind that working.

In general, most practitioners seem to feel that the paths fall into one of the two polarities: Left Hand or Right Hand. And yet, in my own experience, I would have to argue the existence of an Ambidexterous path that blends the elements of the two above extremes. The Ambidexterous Path is probably more appropriately called the Path of Unified Duality, and this is a path that may at first seem to be one of contradiction.

In the Path of Unified Duality, not only are both of the Left Hand and Right Hand approaches seen as true, but also they are seen as being true at the same time without conflict. Thus, in the Path of Unified Duality, the god without is the god within is the god without, each aspect simply being perceived from a different angle. As both the god that is the Self and the god that appears greater than the Self are one and the same, declaring "Thy Will be done" is identical to saying, "My Will be done." Both enact change and both sides are active regardless of which approach the individual is consciously taking. Thus, the power of the deity not only empowers the individual; simultaneously, the deity is the power of the individual and the indidual him- or herself.

Unsurprisingly, if I had to label my own approach in terms of such paths, I would have to say that I follow not the Left Hand Path and certainly not the Right Hand Path, but the Path of Unified Duality.

by Michelle Belanger

WHOA! BACK UP! When in the heck did I say that you were a Christian? I never said you were a Christian! Maybe certain other people assumed you were, but I did NOT! You evidently don't play well with other who do not believe exactly as you believe so why don't you just turn around and leave this thread and not come back.

I smell a fluffy bunny.

Paganesq?! Is that even a word? You consider yourself an eclectic pagan and you didn't even know that Asatru is essentially Norse Paganism?

You know, if you have nothing of substance to offer this conversation why are you even here?

With your same ideals... I guess if it's not in the government's handbook of acceptable religions then I guess it's not a religion then now is it? The government can lick my anus after I take a nice long sh!t.

And please do NOT lump all of Paganism with Wicca. Wicca is a Specific Pagan religion that has indeed been officially acknowledged by the US military and the US Government. However, there are many of religions under the umbrella of Paganism that by your ideals are not officially recognized by the US Government. But in my opinion, just because my government doesn't officially acknowledge them doesn't make them any less of a legitimate religion.

And who or what makes the judgement as to what is a religion and what isn't?

I disagree with you.

LaVeyan Satanism is a religion... their diety is SELF.
Luciferian Satanism (a.k.a. Luciferian Witchcraft) is a religion... their diety is SATAN.