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| Topic: Federal judge strikes down mandatory obama care. | |
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slavery isnt always bad there are times when it is necessary to submit to authority, but thats another topic insurance is a good idea, everyone should have it, otherwise those who do have it will continue to pick up the tab for all the unpaid bills of those who dont If car insurance can be ordered by law, why not health insurance? Yup and a person has a choice to drive or not to drive. |
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Judge Roger Vinson, a Reagan appointee serving in Pensacola, Florida,
Pretty shitty of a US District Judge to play politics. |
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Judge Roger Vinson, a Reagan appointee serving in Pensacola, Florida, Pretty shitty of a US District Judge to play politics. Did you read his ruling? Politics my azz. Was well written. Back to the drawing board for the 'fed' so they can attempt to 'sway' the supreme court. |
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Edited by
Fanta46
on
Mon 01/31/11 09:20 PM
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A federal judge in Florida struck down President Obama’s health-care reform law, saying it is unconstitutional. Twenty-six states sued to overturn the law, and U.S. District Judge Roger Vinson accepted their argument without trial.
26 States with Republican Govs and Repub AGs. Without trial. This was politics just to get the case heard by the Supreme Court where of course their majority is Republican appointed as well. Same thing happened with the Lobbyist laws. |
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Judge Roger Vinson, a Reagan appointee serving in Pensacola, Florida, Pretty shitty of a US District Judge to play politics. The only politics involved in the Obama health care scam was on the side of the rats. |
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A federal judge in Florida struck down President Obama’s health-care reform law, saying it is unconstitutional. Twenty-six states sued to overturn the law, and U.S. District Judge Roger Vinson accepted their argument without trial. 26 States with Republican Govs and Repub AGs. Without trial. This was politics just to get the case heard by the Supreme Court where of course their majority is Republican appointed as well. Same thing happened with the Lobbyist laws. This Judges ruling is only good in Florida. It was politics. A way to get it heard in the Repub controlled Supreme Court. Nothing more. The judge didn't even allow arguments. Politics! |
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Edited by
Fanta46
on
Mon 01/31/11 09:32 PM
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Don't get too excited folks.
Pay attention to the last sentence in this non-Fox article. Time for the Supreme Court to weigh in: A federal judge in Florida struck down President Obama’s health-care reform law, saying it is unconstitutional. Twenty-six states sued to overturn the law, and U.S. District Judge Roger Vinson accepted their argument without trial. They argued that the government cannot force individuals to buy health insurance by 2014 or face penalties. In his decision, Vinson wrote, "It would be a radical departure from existing case law to hold that Congress can regulate inactivity under the Commerce Clause.” This ruling evens the score among lower courts' decisions, with two judges upholding the controversial law and two striking at least part of it down. Here it is again, This ruling evens the score among lower courts' decisions, with two judges upholding the controversial law and two striking at least part of it down. Republican Politics and nothing more. |
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Auto insurance isn't required in all states. As of 6/10 New Hampshire doesn't require auto insurance. The laws for auto insurance varies in different states. Some states you can just show proof of financial responsibility.
The difference (IMO) between auto insurance and Obamacare is this: 1. Auto insurance is up to the states. They decide, not the federal government, for their state 2. Auto insurance (as said above) isn't mandatory in all states and several states will let you show financial responsibility instead of purchasing insurance. 3. Auto insurance protects others for a driver's negligence. People can decide not to purchase insurance that would cover themselves. It protects others so they don't have to pay for someone's negligence. 4. As said before, people can decide not to drive if they don't want to be responsible for their driving. The health insurance....there is no choice. just my input....carry on 
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Judge Roger Vinson, a Reagan appointee serving in Pensacola, Florida, Pretty shitty of a US District Judge to play politics. The only politics involved in the Obama health care scam was on the side of the rats. Yup, just look at Nelson........... |
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A federal judge in Florida struck down President Obama’s health-care reform law, saying it is unconstitutional. Twenty-six states sued to overturn the law, and U.S. District Judge Roger Vinson accepted their argument without trial. 26 States with Republican Govs and Repub AGs. Without trial. This was politics just to get the case heard by the Supreme Court where of course their majority is Republican appointed as well. Same thing happened with the Lobbyist laws. Without trial... Pah more balderdash. Judge in question simply PASSED it up the line... all he really did was say NO to the Federal attempt to have the lawsuit DISMISSED. (That requires no trial)... He simply 'allowed' the suit to go foward... and issued a ruling on a portion of it that 'needed further review' (i.e. the 'mandate' which appears to be un-constitutional). SPIN is easy to counter when the answers are easily found. "Generally, there is no trial in an appellate court, only consideration of the record of the evidence presented to the trial court and all the pre-trial and trial court proceedings are reviewed"... an explanation of the process re federal suits and appeals courts. |
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Here's another article that tells the full story.
Unlike Fox! This ruling is even more sweeping than the Virginia ruling that went against the law. The Florida judge ruled that nothing in the law allows a piecemeal implementation of the law, thus, by ruling a portion of it unconstitutional --the individual mandate-- the entire law is unconstitutional. Judge Vinson, however, refused to issue an injunction stopping implementation of the law pending appeals, a process that could take two years. "That left confusion about how the ruling might be interpreted in the 26 states that are parties to the legal challenge," the NY Times noted. Again, Judge Vinson, however, refused to issue an injunction stopping implementation of the law pending appeals, a process that could take two years. Fox News didn't mention that now did they? |
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Wow!
Deja vu... ok... None of the news services told the full story. (that I could see) Nope and fox news and all the rest of them (i.e cnn, msnbc... etc) also FAILED to mention that Judge Vinson did not STRIKE DOWN THE LAW... He simply ruled on the FEDERAL GOVERNMENTS REQUEST TO HAVE THE SUIT DISMISSED... and aptly wrote a good reason why it should go foward... If he had issued an injunction against the law being implemented he would have been exceeding the authority of the court for the proceedings he was adjudcating. |
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Wow! Deja vu... ok... None of the news services told the full story. (that I could see) Nope and fox news and all the rest of them (i.e cnn, msnbc... etc) also FAILED to mention that Judge Vinson did not STRIKE DOWN THE LAW... He simply ruled on the FEDERAL GOVERNMENTS REQUEST TO HAVE THE SUIT DISMISSED... and aptly wrote a good reason why it should go foward... If he had issued an injunction against the law being implemented he would have been exceeding the authority of the court for the proceedings he was adjudcating. Thank you for your honesty! |
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Edited by
KerryO
on
Tue 02/01/11 12:46 PM
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It seems to me that those people who yell the loudest about this issue think they have a Constitutional right to unpaid-for health care. How is this any different from mooching off the government dole? Their 'freedoms' are being carried on the backs of those who are responsible enough to work and sacrifice TO have health insurance.
Where in the Constitution does it say *I* have to pay for THEIR healthcare when they won't? -Kerry O. |
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what makes you think such people don't work?
Bit of sterotyping here? I suppose you think that anyone without insurance is a feeeloading welfare receipiant sitting on their front porch smoking a fat dube and thinking up ways to 'freeload' of of your superior working sacrafice? |
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Edited by
actionlynx
on
Tue 02/01/11 01:23 PM
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The Constitution says that Congress has the power to REGULATE commerce with foreign powers and amongst the States. What Congress can do is defined in the Constitution, and anything not defined is not within the power of Congress. Nowhere is Congress given the power to MANDATE commerce, which purchasing health insurance falls under....just like purchasing any other goods or service. Therefore, the Health Care Act is unconstitutional in its present form. That is what the judge in Florida was saying. He did not say that the entire Act was unconstitutional, just that it required amendment to make it non-mandatory as it violates the Commerce Clause of the Constitution (read the article, and he did site this). Re-read the Constitution last night before bed, thought about it and what the founding fathers intended. Judge Vinson is right in this case....this goes beyond regulating, and therefore oversteps Federal powers.
To toss out a bit of information... My mother worked as Human Resource Director for a branch of Premier Health Care. Through her work, she discovered that insurance companies are a big reason that health costs have gone through the roof. You see, to cover costs and make more profit, insurance companies in negotiating with hospitals and doctors forced the latter to DOUBLE their rates....that way insurance companies could then RAISE THEIR OWN RATES. Therefore, when you go to the doctor without possessing health insurance, you are actually paying TWICE THE DOCTOR'S RATE. That's right, because insurance companies coerced them to double their service rate, it has become standard practice to charge the same rate no matter what. BUT, if you mention this to your doctor when you lack insurance, more often than not he will slash his rate in half because he knows he isn't losing any money by doing so....he still gets paid and makes the same money. Hence, hospitals can and do make money despite being a non-profit, tax-protected organization....many hospitals then need to spend this excess cash each year to maintain tax-free status, so they perform unnecessary renovations, purchase new equipment that isn't really needed, etc. This profit comes from people who pay out of their own pocket. This is because the insurance companies only pay doctors their ORIGINAL RATE for services rendered. It looks like the insurance gets a cut rate, but in reality they are paying the actual cost of service while raising premiums. IT IS A BIG SCAM, AND THE CONSUMER WAS NEVER INFORMED. So, when you think about health care costs QUADRUPLING, remember that the insurance companies are responsible for HALF of that increase. This is why Congress needs to REGULATE insurance companies, not force health insurance down our throats. |
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what makes you think such people don't work? Bit of sterotyping here? I suppose you think that anyone without insurance is a feeeloading welfare receipiant sitting on their front porch smoking a fat dube and thinking up ways to 'freeload' of of your superior working sacrafice? Read it again. And quote next time before you go off half-cocked by reading into what _wasn't_ said. BTW, do you think unpaid-for healthcare is a Constitutional right or not? And if so, where in the Constitution does it guarantee that? Because if you know you don't have insurance because you refused to buy it when you had the chance, you ARE taking something for nothing when you show up in the ER and expect to be treated just as the rightwingers who push this cause caterwaul about endlessly when people on welfare do the same thing. I've ALWAYS had health insurance, even during the bad times. It saved my life. -Kerry O. |
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The Constitution says that Congress has the power to REGULATE commerce with foreign powers and amongst the States. What Congress can do is defined in the Constitution, and anything not defined is not within the power of Congress. Nowhere is Congress given the power to MANDATE commerce, which purchasing health insurance falls under....just like purchasing any other goods or service. Therefore, the Health Care Act is unconstitutional in its present form. That is what the judge in Florida was saying. He did not say that the entire Act was unconstitutional, just that it required amendment to make it non-mandatory as it violates the Commerce Clause of the Constitution (read the article, and he did site this). Re-read the Constitution last night before bed, thought about it and what the founding fathers intended. Judge Vinson is right in this case....this goes beyond regulating, and therefore oversteps Federal powers. To toss out a bit of information... My mother worked as Human Resource Director for a branch of Premier Health Care. Through her work, she discovered that insurance companies are a big reason that health costs have gone through the roof. You see, to cover costs and make more profit, insurance companies in negotiating with hospitals and doctors forced the latter to DOUBLE their rates....that way insurance companies could then RAISE THEIR OWN RATES. Therefore, when you go to the doctor without possessing health insurance, you are actually paying TWICE THE DOCTOR'S RATE. That's right, because insurance companies coerced them to double their service rate, it has become standard practice to charge the same rate no matter what. BUT, if you mention this to your doctor when you lack insurance, more often than not he will slash his rate in half because he knows he isn't losing any money by doing so....he still gets paid and makes the same money. Hence, hospitals can and do make money despite being a non-profit, tax-protected organization....many hospitals then need to spend this excess cash each year to maintain tax-free status, so they perform unnecessary renovations, purchase new equipment that isn't really needed, etc. This profit comes from people who pay out of their own pocket. This is because the insurance companies only pay doctors their ORIGINAL RATE for services rendered. It looks like the insurance gets a cut rate, but in reality they are paying the actual cost of service while raising premiums. IT IS A BIG SCAM, AND THE CONSUMER WAS NEVER INFORMED. So, when you think about health care costs QUADRUPLING, remember that the insurance companies are responsible for HALF of that increase. This is why Congress needs to REGULATE insurance companies, not force health insurance down our throats. 
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its all good
we will catch up to the rest of the world or we will be left behind,, |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Tue 02/01/11 04:33 PM
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Auto insurance isn't required in all states. As of 6/10 New Hampshire doesn't require auto insurance. The laws for auto insurance varies in different states. Some states you can just show proof of financial responsibility. The difference (IMO) between auto insurance and Obamacare is this: 1. Auto insurance is up to the states. They decide, not the federal government, for their state 2. Auto insurance (as said above) isn't mandatory in all states and several states will let you show financial responsibility instead of purchasing insurance. 3. Auto insurance protects others for a driver's negligence. People can decide not to purchase insurance that would cover themselves. It protects others so they don't have to pay for someone's negligence. 4. As said before, people can decide not to drive if they don't want to be responsible for their driving. The health insurance....there is no choice. just my input....carry on absolutely, 1. states will decide its best to keep hospitals open by mandating insurance 2. it will definitely be a matter of ability to pay and not EVERYONE will be mandated to have health insurance(contrary to popular belief) 3. health insurance covers the hospitals costs for the negligence of patients who may have made bad decisions leading them to a hospital room or prolonged care or for those who are just unable to pay but must still by law be treated 4. people can decide not to have a car, they cant decide not to have health,,,,apples and oranges |
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