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Seamonster's photo
Wed 02/18/09 01:41 PM




The christians that do not believe evolution.






"The Christians" Do I see him saying specific or certain types of christians.....looks up.....no....so therefore is that lumping "The Christians" together. Why yes Bob I believe it is. So tell them what they win....Well Debbie they win the comment that I made previously.......So voil there ya have it....plain as the nose on your face.


wow you realy know how to read things into stuff thats not there.
I posted it and I know what I meant.
I thought it was obvious, and it is to most I think.

I said "The christians that do not believe evolution."
These People call them selves christians.
These people do not believe evolution.
Did I say All christians are these people?
No of course not.
Again what you are saying is NOT correct.


H E L L O

When you "The Christians" You are lumping them together. Now if you would of said "The specific Church" that was protesting then ok.....And hmmmmmm can you tell me how to take it.......NO Can you tell me how to feel.....NO How to think NO.......And just because "You" know what you mean doesn't mean we will.....so if your going to do this in the future maybe be a lil more clear....

I am no ones judge....just as you are not. If people want to protest anything....It is "YES" there God given right to do so.


Wrong, it is NOT a "god" given right.
It is a right that the U.S. constitution gives.
It has nothing to do with your or anyone elses god.

Seamonster's photo
Wed 02/18/09 05:29 AM





Seamonster's photo
Tue 02/17/09 06:52 PM
Edited by Seamonster on Tue 02/17/09 06:54 PM


One wonder's if Feral's question will be asked 50 years from today?

In the year 2059...

Will Christian's still have a huge following and those Christians who don't believe in Evolution have a greater following then they do today?

Will they convince Evolutionist's or others who deem uncertain that the Bible is the true calling?

Will those who don't believe in Evolution still believe the Bible is the closest history of how everything started?

Will there still be debates between Creationists and Evolutionists that argue or debate what is true or not?

In the end will it be important or will we repeat history and create the same chaos we humans always tend to do when two opposing sides disagree?

Will Christianity and its following denominations eventually go to the category (already is for some) Mythology and join the stories of Greek, Roman, Norse, and Celtic Mythologies?

Or will it gain popularity as poverty increases across the world and people clinge to the teachings of preachers??

I guess in the end one just has to wait and see as only few sit and actually find out for themselves through research and study.



Christianity has been dominant in this age of Pisces and this age is coming to an end.

It will pass into myth within a hundred years I estimate.




Right,
Christianity is dieing.
The days when money is spent on this.


(Megachurch)


Instead of this.



Are hopefully close to an end.

Seamonster's photo
Tue 02/17/09 06:46 PM


The christians that do not believe evolution.






"The Christians" Do I see him saying specific or certain types of christians.....looks up.....no....so therefore is that lumping "The Christians" together. Why yes Bob I believe it is. So tell them what they win....Well Debbie they win the comment that I made previously.......So voil there ya have it....plain as the nose on your face.


wow you realy know how to read things into stuff thats not there.
I posted it and I know what I meant.
I thought it was obvious, and it is to most I think.

I said "The christians that do not believe evolution."
These People call them selves christians.
These people do not believe evolution.
Did I say All christians are these people?
No of course not.
Again what you are saying is NOT correct.

Seamonster's photo
Tue 02/17/09 05:54 AM
Karma is selfish.
I do good because I want to not because there may be some reward for it.
And I've seen to many $hitty things happen to good people to believe in Karma.

Seamonster's photo
Tue 02/17/09 05:51 AM
good quotes enjoyed them thanks.

Seamonster's photo
Mon 02/16/09 07:50 PM
Edited by Seamonster on Mon 02/16/09 07:51 PM

I pray for all the wrong reasons. Winning the lottery, getting laid, etc...

laugh

If someone I care about is hurting, emotionally, or physically, I will send some prayers their way.



Note: I'm not a Christian, but sometimes I pray to my higher power.

drinker


same, and my higher power is Abe Vagoda.



Seamonster's photo
Mon 02/16/09 07:07 PM
Don't see much use in praying.
Never it seen it help anyone outside of some placebo thing.

Seamonster's photo
Mon 02/16/09 07:00 PM
The christians that do not believe evolution.



Seamonster's photo
Mon 02/16/09 06:30 PM


Evolution has proven the bible false and obsolete.
So no, they are not compatible.


Creation proves the Bible and ever will it be obsolete so yea.....But believe you came from an ape...ok by me.


uhg.
Yes creation proves the bible and I came from an ape.

I think I know the mentality I'm dealing with here.
You just flat out refuse to learn, and you have no concept of evolution or what it is.
"creation proves the bible" is a statement that not only makes absolutly no sense but shows an incredible amount of ignorance.

Seamonster's photo
Sun 02/15/09 05:34 PM
it's a good read if you ever get the chance.

Seamonster's photo
Sun 02/15/09 05:29 PM
Why Don't Jews Believe in Jesus?
by Rabbi Shraga Simmons

For 2,000 years, Jews have rejected the Christian idea of Jesus as messiah. Why?

It is important to understand why Jews don't believe in Jesus. The purpose is not to disparage other religions, but rather to clarify the Jewish position. The more data that's available, the better-informed choices people can make about their spiritual path.

Jews do not accept Jesus as the messiah because:


1) Jesus did not fulfill the messianic prophecies.


2) Jesus did not embody the personal qualifications of the Messiah.


3) Biblical verses "referring" to Jesus are mistranslations.


4) Jewish belief is based on national revelation.


At the end of this article, we will examine these additional topics:


5) Christianity contradicts Jewish theology


6) Jews and Gentiles


7) Bringing the Messiah

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1) JESUS DID NOT FULFILL THE MESSIANIC PROPHECIES

What is the Messiah supposed to accomplish? The Bible says that he will:

A. Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).

B. Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).

C. Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)

D. Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel, which will unite humanity as one. As it says: "God will be King over all the world -- on that day, God will be One and His Name will be One" (Zechariah 14:9).

The historical fact is that Jesus fulfilled none of these messianic prophecies.

Christians counter that Jesus will fulfill these in the Second Coming, but Jewish sources show that the Messiah will fulfill the prophecies outright, and no concept of a second coming exists.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2) JESUS DID NOT EMBODY THE PERSONAL QUALIFICATIONS OF MESSIAH

A. MESSIAH AS PROPHET

Jesus was not a prophet. Prophecy can only exist in Israel when the land is inhabited by a majority of world Jewry. During the time of Ezra (circa 300 BCE), when the majority of Jews refused to move from Babylon to Israel, prophecy ended upon the death of the last prophets -- Haggai, Zechariah and Malachi.

Jesus appeared on the scene approximately 350 years after prophecy had ended.

B. DESCENDENT OF DAVID

The Messiah must be descended on his father's side from King David (see Genesis 49:10 and Isaiah 11:1). According to the Christian claim that Jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father -- and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father's side from King David!

C. TORAH OBSERVANCE

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3) MISTRANSLATED VERSES "REFERRING" TO JESUS

Biblical verses can only be understood by studying the original Hebrew text -- which reveals many discrepancies in the Christian translation.

A. VIRGIN BIRTH

The Christian idea of a virgin birth is derived from the verse in Isaiah 7:14 describing an "....alma...." as giving birth. The word "....alma...." has always meant a young woman, but Christian theologians came centuries later and translated it as "virgin." This accords Jesus' birth with the first century pagan idea of mortals being impregnated by gods.

B. CRUCIFIXION

The verse in Psalms 22:17 reads: "Like a lion, they are at my hands and feet." The Hebrew word ki-ari (like a lion) is grammatically similar to the word "gouged." Thus Christianity reads the verse as a reference to crucifixion: "They pierced my hands and feet."

C. SUFFERING SERVANT

Christianity claims that Isaiah chapter 53 refers to Jesus, as the "suffering servant."

In actuality, Isaiah 53 directly follows the theme of chapter 52, describing the exile and redemption of the Jewish people. The prophecies are written in the singular form because the Jews ("Israel") are regarded as one unit. The Torah is filled with examples of the Jewish nation referred to with a singular pronoun.

Ironically, Isaiah's prophecies of persecution refer in part to the 11th century when Jews were tortured and killed by Crusaders who acted in the name of Jesus.

From where did these mistranslations stem? St. Gregory, 4th century Bishop of Nanianzus, wrote: "A little jargon is all that is necessary to impose on the people. The less they comprehend, the more they admire."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

4) JEWISH BELIEF IS BASED SOLELY ON NATIONAL REVELATION

Of the 15,000 religions in human history, only Judaism bases its belief on national revelation -- i.e. God speaking to the entire nation. If God is going to start a religion, it makes sense He'll tell everyone, not just one person.

Judaism, unique among all of the world's major religions, does not rely on "claims of miracles" as the basis for its religion. In fact, the Bible says that God sometimes grants the power of "miracles" to charlatans, in order to test Jewish loyalty to the Torah (Deut. 13:4).

Maimonides states (Foundations of Torah, ch. 8):

The Jews did not believe in Moses, our teacher, because of the miracles he performed. Whenever anyone's belief is based on seeing miracles, he has lingering doubts, because it is possible the miracles were performed through magic or sorcery. All of the miracles performed by Moses in the desert were because they were necessary, and not as proof of his prophecy.

What then was the basis of [Jewish] belief? The Revelation at Mount Sinai, which we saw with our own eyes and heard with our own ears, not dependent on the testimony of others... as it says, "Face to face, God spoke with you..." The Torah also states: "God did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us -- who are all here alive today." (Deut. 5:3)

Judaism is not miracles. It is the personal eyewitness experience of every man, woman and child, standing at Mount Sinai 3,300 years ago.

See "Did God Speak at Mount Sinai" for further reading.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5) CHRISTIANITY CONTRADICTS JEWISH THEOLOGY

The following theological points apply primarily to the Roman Catholic Church, the largest Christian denomination.

A. GOD AS THREE?

The Catholic idea of Trinity breaks God into three separate beings: The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost (Matthew 28:19).

Contrast this to the Shema, the basis of Jewish belief: "Hear O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is ONE" (Deut. 6:4). Jews declare the Shema every day, while writing it on doorposts (Mezuzah), and binding it to the hand and head (Tefillin). This statement of God's One-ness is the first words a Jewish child is taught to say, and the last words uttered before a Jew dies.

In Jewish law, worship of a three-part god is considered idolatry -- one of the three cardinal sins that a Jew should rather give up his life than transgress. This explains why during the Inquisitions and throughout history, Jews gave up their lives rather than convert.

B. MAN AS GOD?

Roman Catholics believe that God came down to earth in human form, as Jesus said: "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30).

Maimonides devotes most of the "Guide for the Perplexed" to the fundamental idea that God is incorporeal, meaning that He assumes no physical form. God is Eternal, above time. He is Infinite, beyond space. He cannot be born, and cannot die. Saying that God assumes human form makes God small, diminishing both His unity and His divinity. As the Torah says: "God is not a mortal" (Numbers 23:19).

Judaism says that the Messiah will be born of human parents, and possess normal physical attributes like other people. He will not be a demi-god, and will not possess supernatural qualities. In fact, an individual is alive in every generation with the capacity to step into the role of the Messiah. (see Maimonides - Laws of Kings 11:3)

C. INTERMEDIARY FOR PRAYER?

The Catholic belief is that prayer must be directed through an intermediary -- i.e. confessing one's sins to a priest. Jesus himself is an intermediary, as Jesus said: "No man cometh unto the Father but by me."

In Judaism, prayer is a totally private matter, between each individual and God. As the Bible says: "God is near to all who call unto Him" (Psalms 145:18). Further, the Ten Commandments state: "You shall have no other gods BEFORE ME," meaning that it is forbidden to set up a mediator between God and man. (see Maimonides - Laws of Idolatry ch. 1)

D. INVOLVEMENT IN THE PHYSICAL WORLD

Catholic doctrine often treats the physical world as an evil to be avoided. Mary, the holiest woman, is portrayed as a virgin. Priests and nuns are celibate. And monasteries are in remote, secluded locations.

By contrast, Judaism believes that God created the physical world not to frustrate us, but for our pleasure. Jewish spirituality comes through grappling with the mundane world in a way that uplifts and elevates. Sex in the proper context is one of the holiest acts we can perform.

The Talmud says if a person has the opportunity to taste a new fruit and refuses to do so, he will have to account for that in the World to Come. Jewish rabbinical schools teach how to live amidst the bustle of commercial activity. Jews don't retreat from life, we elevate it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

6) JEWS AND GENTILES

Judaism does not demand that everyone convert to the religion. The Torah of Moses is a truth for all humanity, whether Jewish or not. King Solomon asked God to heed the prayers of non-Jews who come to the Holy Temple (Kings I 8:41-43). The prophet Isaiah refers to the Temple as a "House for all nations."

The Temple service during Sukkot featured 70 bull offerings, corresponding to the 70 nations of the world. The Talmud says that if the Romans would have realized how much benefit they were getting from the Temple, they'd never have destroyed it.

Jews have never actively sought converts to Judaism because the Torah prescribes a righteous path for gentiles to follow, known as the "Seven Laws of Noah." Maimonides explains that any human being who faithfully observes these basic moral laws earns a proper place in heaven.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

7) BRINGING THE MESSIAH

Maimonides states that the popularity of Christianity (and Islam) is part of God's plan to spread the ideals of Torah throughout the world. This moves society closer to a perfected state of morality and toward a greater understanding of God. All this is in preparation for the Messianic age

Indeed, the world is in desperate need of Messianic redemption. War and pollution threaten our planet; ego and confusion erode family life. To the extent we are aware of the problems of society, is the extent we will yearn for redemption. As the Talmud says, one of the first questions a Jew is asked on Judgment Day is: "Did you yearn for the arrival of the Messiah?"

How can we hasten the coming of the Messiah? The best way is to love all humanity generously, to keep the mitzvot of the Torah (as best we can), and to encourage others to do so as well.

Despite the gloom, the world does seem headed toward redemption. One apparent sign is that the Jewish people have returned to the Land of Israel and made it bloom again. Additionally, a major movement is afoot of young Jews returning to Torah tradition.

The Messiah can come at any moment, and it all depends on our actions. God is ready when we are. For as King David says: "Redemption will come today -- if you hearken to His voice."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For further study, read:

"The Real Messiah," by Rabbi Aryeh Kaplan
"The Path of the Righteous Gentile," by Chaim Clorfene and Yakov Rogalsky
"The Seven Colors of the Rainbow," by Rabbi Yirmeyahu Bindman

Seamonster's photo
Sun 02/15/09 05:12 PM
Evolution has proven the bible false and obsolete.
So no, they are not compatible.

Seamonster's photo
Thu 02/12/09 06:17 PM

Seamonster's photo
Thu 02/12/09 05:36 PM
the bible needs a ceterfold.

Seamonster's photo
Wed 02/11/09 06:14 PM


Does it say in the old or new testament of the bible that "Thou shall not kill?"

If this is to be true then why is half of the book full of stories about killing? The many wars is about killing?

If this is true then why is there a hell that will end your eternal soul? Isn't that killing?

If this is true why must Jesus die on a cross showing us death? (I know why historically and have my reasons to believe them, but would like to know why you believe this to be true concerning the contradiction to the phrase "Thou shall not kill")

and I probably missed many many more acts of killing approved by The God of Abraham that goes with the contradiction of "Thou shall not kill."


This is a earnest question for those who study the bible, for it would interest me how it is actually interperated by those who study theology.

thank you.




In the King James - the English translates into "kill". As in "Thou shalt not kill"

In the more modern versions - it is "Murder".

When one examines the English exegesis, the correct interpretation is murder, as it would be difficult to carry out the necessary sacrifices of Leviticus without "killing" a beast for it.


yeah this is my understanding of it also.

Seamonster's photo
Wed 02/11/09 06:07 PM


very eloquently put. you have your beliefs, and I have mine. one day we will all know the truth... we might as well all get along for the time being and learn, and grow with each other.


I do not BELIEVE in evolution. I accept it as the only theory that explains ALL of the evidence.


ok wait, now billy I usaly agree with you, but ONLY a theory?
A theory is pretty sound.
In alot of cases I'll take a theory over a fact.
A theory has gone through alot of testing for many years.
And a law is what explains the theory.

Seamonster's photo
Tue 02/10/09 06:53 PM
1) The Genesis Creation Myth in the Bible says that God made man directly from the dust of the ground. Evolution says humans are the (current) endproduct of some 3.5 billion years of evolution.

2) The Genesis Creation Myth in the Bible says that God made woman from a rib He yanked out of the first man. Evolution says humans are the (current) endproduct of some 3.5 billion years of evolution.

3) The Genesis Creation Myth in the Bible says that angiosperms appeared before animals. Evolution says that angiosperms appeared some 400 million years after animals did.

4) The Genesis Creation Myth in the Bible says that birds appeared before land animals. Evolution says that birds appeared some 250 million years after land animals did.

5) The Genesis Flood Myth in the Bible says that the animals not on the ark were killed during the flood, only some 4000 years ago. Evolution says no such near-complete mass extinction occurred anywhere near that time.

Seamonster's photo
Tue 02/10/09 06:24 PM


There is nothing in the fossil record that Charles Darwin did not predict would be there....


who gives a rats ass? he didn't believe it proved his theory so that should give you a little hint... if Jesus Christ, while dying on the cross, said he wasn't really God's son who would even follow Christianity?


and what of Krishna when they killed him?
he still was called the son of god and they still follow him.
No real diffrence in story lines.

Seamonster's photo
Tue 02/10/09 06:22 PM

here is one thing that really confuses me about evolutionists... the whole fossil record thing... why would you take to heart something that the founder (charles darwin) didn't even recognize as supporting fact for evolution? fossils without links prove nothing...

also, how can a cell (organic life) be created from inorganic matter? with all of the technology we have today, scientists STILL cannot create a left-hand protein molecule (found in all animals).





pfft,
60 yrs ago we said science still hast put a man on the moon.
30 yrs ago cloneing was stull in sci-fi books,
20yrs ago we still hadnt crack the gnome.
You can't judge science by what we havent done yet.
Science is haveing an idea and triyng to disprove it.
Religion is haveing an idea and then twisting or disregarding facts to make that idea seem plausible.

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