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real commitment is after all those wonderful years spent together you clip each others toenails because neither one you can reach that far anymore.. Wow Argo ! How sweet and gross all at the same time ...  z
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.. I once saw this bedroom where the bed was built into an aquarium with fish and things swimming about, it was awesome, I want one..  Aquaticly peaceful surroundings would be cool. Heck it's not every day you get to see fish potty in their own habitat right above your head. Yes it is gorgeous Peggy, but a bit    This is mingle Integrity . Which thread actually remains on topic? 
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Many people , including myself have been conditioned to believe that the ultimate goal of a relationship is either marriage, and/or children or at least moving in together.For those who dont want marriage , kids, or even to share a home, is there a next level to the relationship?Do you think people can be perceived as having a committed relationship, if none of the above conditions exist ,but they love and support each other emotionally , physically etc? nope. the whole point is to get married and have children. anything else is just friends Some will agree with you on that SDSCF . My question to you is this. after you have already had the mariiage, kids or shared living space with someone else, and it fails, does that mean that their future relationship choices only include friendships or lovers? No other options? what are you aking? You were saying the whole point of a relationship is marriage and children Im asking you this... If a person had children in a marriage that failed, are you saying that they can no longer have a serious relationship with someine else if they dont wish to remarry of have any more kids? |
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Topic:
Ghosting
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I've been Ghosted and Bread crumbed in this year already. Will just say both of the terms and the actions that go along, Just completely suck!    Aaawwwww... sorry to hear about that scoob
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Playing mind games is a time waster for all involved Amen Rusty ! Especially when you are older |
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Edited by
peggy122
on
Sun 11/12/17 05:29 AM
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Hi Peggy I always thought of mind games to be someone leading their partner to believe something when the opposite is true. Mind gamers suck! A very belated Hi Johnn It involves deception but its also an insiduous tool used to manipulate someone's behavior |
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I think it is important to note that romantic relationships are not the only place we are faced with mind games. Family (squabbles, quarrels & feuds) Work places (office politics, peer grouping) Events (group forming, group mindsets) Basically, any place we interact with other people there are mind games. The motives behind them might be different but the games still exist. I believe there are very few people that operate on the level, at most times, in most situations. Mind games are not restricted to verbal communication. Action and inaction can also be used as a game tool. Strategy of causing someone to form an opinion about someone else that coincides with your motive. Strategy to cause another person to act by causing or withholding some deed. Deception and delusion is deeply rooted in societies. Can you even imagine living in a world where manipulation doesn't exist, at all? You dress in those clothes because they are in fashion. You buy that product because people say it is the best. You go do things because others say its great. You vote that way because others convince you. Anytime we do something contrary to our basic will we are being mind gamed by someone/something else. I believe this is why there are so many people that are unhappy and stressed out. They are being played to be something they are not and the conflict is hidden by overload. Hmmmm, Hadnt though of those scenarios as games tom,,, just annoying norms , but I guess they can be both 
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We humans r social nd family oriented. Everyone builds the legacy nd estates of their own. People's success too always measured in the name of net worth of personalities. A person who doesn't want to raise his networth nd power of monies in assets nd estates might be a saint nd not interested in worldlg matters. A mother or father earns fame nd money not just for themselves for the legacy to carry on. Its egoistic personality to establish power nd such earner would like to carry forward his legacy through future generations. If he doesn't want then he will not be interested in kids marriage or any such arrangemenrs nor he or she would be interested in building such estates or legacies. If such a saint getting into another saint really difficult nd also just to desire happiness through association. Or it might be a situation who is admiring this personality failing to getting into this personality and just accepting it as there is no other choice if deeply in love. Either way, a family celebrates their happiness at every milestone nd most of these r associated with family kids nd thieir achievements. Under such set up people liviving will be devoid of all such happinesss. This they would realise now nd then nd will repent also in future. So there is no next level for them. Everyone has their mildstones, but maybe couples who dont marry, have kids or share a space create their own version of mildstones? Thanks for your contribution Manseekingwomen :) |
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Everyone has their mildstones, but maybe couples who dont marry, have kids or share a space create their own version of mildstones? Thanks for your contribution Manseekingwomen :)
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Edited by
peggy122
on
Sun 11/12/17 04:43 AM
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Many people , including myself have been conditioned to believe that the ultimate goal of a relationship is either marriage, and/or children or at least moving in together. For those who dont want marriage , kids, or even to share a home, is there a next level to the relationship? Do you think people can be perceived as having a committed relationship, if none of the above conditions exist ,but they love and support each other emotionally , physically etc? To me the ultimate goal isn't kids or marriage, but happiness. Wanting to share experiences together. Nourish, nurture, love, share, and support so you grow and develop as individuals. To appreciate the other, and be grateful every day that they are in your life, because it is a choice, you do not own your partner. Not even when you've put a wedding band on their finger. Making that choice every day to love, cherish, honour the other and to be grateful and happy with the presence. You don't need kids for that, nor marriage, not even living together. You may wish to have those things, yes. But they should be the icing on the cake, not the goal. Those things should come from sheer desire and love that you already share. To be honest I feel many cannot understand this until they've reached a certain age, cos when younger you still have so many ego needs. Im agreeing with you Crystal but rather than happiness, I will use the term mutual fulfilment , which I suspect many people ultimately seek in their relationship. The challenge with that premise is that everyone has their own perception of what fulfillment looks and feels like based on their life experiences and needs. And thats perhaps where the vision of kids, marriage , sharing a living space , etc come into play . For some people that is what fulfilment or happiness looks like to THEM, not necessarily for ego driven motives. Also , if we are talking about commitment , some people think of one's level of investment. For those who are contented with a mate"s investment of time , companionship and passion, the trappings of shared assets are non consequential but for those who seek a more holistic investment, more might be required. In other words, cherishing and loving each other fulfil some important needs, but neglect other fundamental needs depending on the person. It always comes down to the couple in question doesnt it? .... No right or wrong... just whatever feels right and fulfilling for the couple For most needing marriage and kids etc. IS from the ego. Security, status, meeting demands of society, not feeling complete without it, and so on. That IS ego. It'd be different if 2 people love each other the way I described, then say "I would really love to have a child with you, raise another human being with you!" For most it's more like: You don't want children? Next! It's a demand, a deal-breaker. That's entirely different from wanting a child with someone from a place of loving the partner and having a desire to co-create. Not saying there's anything wrong with it, most ppl (still) are/live that way. But it's still ego-based fulfillment. Im sure many people are that way Crystal . Im not sure if they are in the majority though . I have no way of knowing |
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I love all the questions you listed Ladybug :)
The challenge is maintaining a cool or even sparkling vibe while asking those questions so that it doesn't feel like an interview lol |
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Im throwing this question I asked Igor to the rest of the forum . Although no one can foresee or guarantee a future of commitment from someone, many actually use a partner's desire for marriage etc as a reference point in the commitment screening process or even a red flag of them having commitment issues, when the desire is not there. What do you look for when determining who shows signs of commitment versus those that dont? |
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 I agree To me the ultimate goal isn't kids or marriage, but happiness. Wanting to share experiences together. Nourish, nurture, love, share, and support so you grow and develop as individuals. To appreciate the other, and be grateful every day that they are in your life, because it is a choice, you do not own your partner. Not even when you've put a wedding band on their finger. Making that choice every day to love, cherish, honor the other and to be grateful and happy with the presence. You don't need kids for that, nor marriage, not even living together. You may wish to have those things, yes. But they should be the icing on the cake, not the goal. Those things should come from sheer desire and love that you already share. To be honest I feel many cannot understand this until they've reached a certain age, cos when younger you still think of all the traditional things in life you want ... and you can have a FWB may not be what you want to call it... but if you both trust one another... an to be faithful to each other ... then I see nothing wrong with that ... I totally agree Mystical that people can have FWBs or any number of relationship alternatives once its legal :) So I will just re-post my comment to the quote you featured. Im agreeing with you Crystal but rather than happiness, I will use the term mutual fulfilment , which I suspect many people ultimately seek in their relationship. The challenge with that premise is that everyone has their own perception of what fulfillment looks and feels like based on their life experiences and needs. And thats perhaps where the vision of kids, marriage , sharing a living space , etc come into play . For some people that is what fulfilment or happiness looks like to THEM, not necessarily for ego driven motives. Also , if we are talking about commitment , some people think of one's level of investment. For those who are contented with a mate"s investment of time , companionship and passion, the trappings of shared assets are non consequential but for those who seek a more holistic investment, more might be required. In other words, cherishing and loving each other fulfil some important needs, but neglect other fundamental needs depending on the person. It always comes down to the couple in question doesnt it? .... No right or wrong... just whatever feels right and fulfilling for the couple Do you agree? |
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Many people , including myself have been conditioned to believe that the ultimate goal of a relationship is either marriage, and/or children or at least moving in together.For those who dont want marriage , kids, or even to share a home, is there a next level to the relationship?Do you think people can be perceived as having a committed relationship, if none of the above conditions exist ,but they love and support each other emotionally , physically etc? nope. the whole point is to get married and have children. anything else is just friends Some will agree with you on that SDSCF . My question to you is this. after you have already had the mariiage, kids or shared living space with someone else, and it fails, does that mean that their future relationship choices only include friendships or lovers? No other options? |
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Let's look at this from a couple perspectives. You grow up seeing a certain type of broken relationship (Maybe Mom went from guy to guy, daddy wasn't around....or perhaps one parent was abusive to the other) and you therefore feel that this is normal. Then you see a "happy" relationship and you begin to crave that. It's normal to want that because what makes us happy makes for a better life right? Or you grow up with loving parents and you crave that, only to find that mom and dad put up a facade. Then you believe that this is normal so you find someone and you begin to treat him/her in the same manor. It's love right? Or your perception of it. My point is that a relationship is what you make of it....and it really shouldn't matter how you are the one you love make it work. In today's world, anything taboo is actually becoming "normal". I agree goof. It all depends on the couple's version of what commitment is and if they can make it work for THEM
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Regardless of the details, married or not married, living together or not, there are ALWAYS at least two "levels" possible. This is because ACTUAL COMMITMENT is makes everything different, regardless of all other labels, stories, or details. The thing I focus on the most, is that it is or isn't truly a commitment. People who get married are no more or less committed by that act than people who don't. That is the lesson of all the "marriages" which fail, because one or both people are only "committed" to the extent that they have a list of mate-services in mind, and ditch the mate if those services aren't performed. That's not real commitment, as far as I'm concerned. Bottom line from my perspective, there are always two potential levels, and real commitment is the dividing point between them. This makes sense Igor. And although no one can foresee or guarantee a future of commitment from someone, many actually use a partner's desire for marriage etc as a reference point in the commitment screening process or even a redflag of them having commitment issues, when the desire is not there. What do you look for when determining who shows signs of commitment versus those that dont? |
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i know a few who have been together for years in just such conditions. they seem very happy and it seem to work for them. they do most everything together they just won't sell the extra house To be honest eric, I used to look at that as longterm dating, and I always assumed that there was an oprness to dating other proplr in that arrangement. It never occurred to me that it could be an exclusive and committed arrangement for life umtil maybe a few months ago. I think its more common.for one oerson to be happy and the other person to want more though ahh but see you assumed with out knowing as for the second part if only one is ok with it then it will end once the dissatisfied party gets tired of waiting for a change in status I think there are cases where the person who wants more doesnt always walk out Eric.Some carefully weigh the advantages and disadvantages of leaving and stay if one outweighs the other of course peggy i just didn't draw it all the way out. i just kind of skipped to the and of the weighing it out process and said gets tired of it. I understand eric... And yes. That's a very feasible result at the end |
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Edited by
peggy122
on
Fri 11/10/17 07:50 AM
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Many people , including myself have been conditioned to believe that the ultimate goal of a relationship is either marriage, and/or children or at least moving in together. For those who dont want marriage , kids, or even to share a home, is there a next level to the relationship? Do you think people can be perceived as having a committed relationship, if none of the above conditions exist ,but they love and support each other emotionally , physically etc? To me the ultimate goal isn't kids or marriage, but happiness. Wanting to share experiences together. Nourish, nurture, love, share, and support so you grow and develop as individuals. To appreciate the other, and be grateful every day that they are in your life, because it is a choice, you do not own your partner. Not even when you've put a wedding band on their finger. Making that choice every day to love, cherish, honour the other and to be grateful and happy with the presence. You don't need kids for that, nor marriage, not even living together. You may wish to have those things, yes. But they should be the icing on the cake, not the goal. Those things should come from sheer desire and love that you already share. To be honest I feel many cannot understand this until they've reached a certain age, cos when younger you still have so many ego needs. Im agreeing with you Crystal but rather than happiness, I will use the term mutual fulfilment , which I suspect many people ultimately seek in their relationship. The challenge with that premise is that everyone has their own perception of what fulfillment looks and feels like based on their life experiences and needs. And thats perhaps where the vision of kids, marriage , sharing a living space , etc come into play . For some people that is what fulfilment or happiness looks like to THEM, not necessarily for ego driven motives. Also , if we are talking about commitment , some people think of one's level of investment. For those who are contented with a mate"s investment of time , companionship and passion, the trappings of shared assets are non consequential but for those who seek a more holistic investment, more might be required. In other words, cherishing and loving each other fulfil some important needs, but neglect other fundamental needs depending on the person. It always comes down to the couple in question doesnt it? .... No right or wrong... just whatever feels right and fulfilling for the couple |
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That is a YES! and NO! Question... I knew a man who met his partner in high school, for 36yrs she would not marry him. They had 5 kids together, neither of them wanted to play into the piece of paper, ring, I owe you and you owe men, in sickness or better for worse,(death do us apart) game as they called it. My son was dating their daughter in the 6th grade he was so in love with her. Anyway! Long story short When the kids got into High School. The couple GOT MARRIED~ it took them that long to commit to each other, they lived in the same house since he bought it for her for a graduation present and asked her to marry him, She said NO! But She gave in and Married him. 2nd real-life story: Back in the old days years before the 1960's that messed everything all up! Free love! it still hurts us today! A woman was taught to never date a man unless he had good intentions and was willing to date for 3 yrs. But remember the boy was only a Senior and the girl was in the 10th grade. So for the next 3 years, the boy is working hard making a future for his girlfriend and him, he buys her a home, a car and when she graduates he is allowed to marry her the next day!... The 4 years later had children, and in that; they grew old together for 42yrs until he died on the job as a fireman! 3rd life story: I knew a person who got married 7 times. Looking for love. The first husband lasted 1 yr. Second husband 3 yrs. Third husband 10 yrs, Fourth husband 3 months, Fifth husband 1yr. Sixth husband, 6months, and the last husband 31yrs today they are still married he was a Jehovah Witness. This young man is 13yrs younger than his wife, and she told him directly, I will never marry you for I have been married way too many times, I have been abused and hurt and destroyed. If you want to live with me you must support me, have a house for me, and take care of me, If you ever cheat I will leave you. This man fell so deeply for this women that he climbed every mountain, swam every ocean, just to be with her. He left his wife and 2 children, to be with this women, he left his church and he was becoming a Minister but found it was not the life for him. He wanted something different. One day he saw this woman sitting in a coffee shop and with tears in her eyes. He asked if he could sit with her and she said fine but I don't want to talk. Day after day he showed up to the same place and year after year. Then one day he asked her, Can I date you and she said NO! but you can fix my roof and replace my floor. So he did that, then 3 yrs later he asked (I have proven myself to you as a man) Will you date me! She said, My car is broken it needs to be fixed; fix it and I will allow you to visit me but I will not date you. 5 years went by and again he asked will you allow me to date you, she said NO! Then can I move in with you, I am spending so much on rent that I could be giving to you, so he became a part of the family but he had his own room and paid her the rent. 10 yrs go by and Little by little this man proved his loyalty, his workmanship, his honor and dedication to this woman who was broken. He gave her everything she needed in life and let her cry on his shoulder. 20 yrs went by and she started to fall in love with him for real, little by little she opened up her heart to him. He asked one day will you date me and she said NO! Not ever will I ever date a man for all the Lie's are not needed! This man stopped asking that day knowing he can only live in her home and do things for her and be by his side. 30 yrs go by and Her daughter on Christmas who was in her 40's asked her mother to Marry this man for a Christmas present! Her mother said NO! I will not marry this man. Her daughter begged her mother please he has done so much for you for 30yrs don't you love him, she said Yes! I love him but I am scared of Marriage, 6failed marriages I do not want another one. The daughter said Ok On 2008, The old women and man in their 60's on Christmas Day went to Las Vegas and Made her Daughters Wish Come True! I am the Daughter of this Mother! I wanted a Father to love my mother, and I wanted this wonderful man to finally get his dream. It took all these years for the FEAR in my Mothers heart To Disappear! My real dad died in 2010, but my stepfather still is alive while my mother is dying as we speak. She has maybe a year if that! The greatest man I ever Knew other then my father was my stepfather. My stepfather told me, My dear never settle for less if a man can not work hard for you, give you everything you ever ask for and treat you like you are an Angel then he is not worth a pebbles on the bottom of your shoes, A man must move mountains, then boulders, then rocks, then shovel pebbles to get into a women's heart but once he is in it she will never let him go! That is a GREAT MAN! I have been married, I have dated many years ago and it made me cry and it made me feel old. it striped my dignaty as a women and human person, it took everything I had in side of me and left me empty so I would never want to date again. If a man can not trust God and Courage to have faith that I am the women for him, then I will stay single until and married to God! Not a MAN! Amen Im sorry to hear about your mom ladybug sunshine. She is very blessed to have met your stepdad! In as much as this thread is about commitment, it sounds to me in the scenatios you shared that the couples were in a committed relationship! They just either had not married or given their relationship a label. Thats really the underlying question , isnt it? When you take marriage, kids and living together out of the equation, what anchors the relationship to make it committed? For some , the anchor is unconditional and consistent love. For others there must be a grand tangible symbol or mildstone . |
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Leveling Up a relationship... Kinda makes me think of school. First you pull a bunch of different girls hair and pick on them. Then you have lots of classes with them and try to sit by them Then you start eating lunch with them Then you walk them to the bus. Then you go to a dance together Then you do a few Friday night dates Then you hang with them over a weekend Then you start hanging with them every day Then you start going to each other's houses Then you start spending more time with them Then you move in together Then you get married & have kids Then you get sick of each other and separate Then you get a divorce and do a battle over the kids Then you start looking to do it again with someone else. Yup, lots of levels. Well if you are blessed enough to find the right match match for you, hopefully all that leveling would have been worth it :) |
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